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Leon On about 4 hours ago




San Diego, California
#1New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 05:10:49
Has half the nation gone insane? Can someone explain this to me?

In 2016, I was devastated when Trump got elected, but I didn’t go around believing the s*** that is being spouted today by, politicians, leaders, SENATORS, pundits, 80% of Trump voters, who all willingly follow the fantasy that the election is rampantly fraudulent and state legislators should effectively kill democracy so Trump can get a second term.

Maybe it’s the coronavirus or maybe we overdid it with the participation trophies in raising our kids, but....

what the f*** is wrong with everyone?!?!??

Accept defeat and move on. Jesus Christ.
chaski On 28 minutes ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#2New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 05:41:31
Trump and his followers have turned into "Karen".
dookie On about 7 hours ago
Foolish Bombu





, United Kingdom
#3New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 08:47:37
Part, as I see it, of a general malaise in our current world. "Everyone is entitled to their opinion" has become "any opinion is as good as another" irrespective of the weight of corroborating support.

More, there have been four years of any "alternative reality" being discounted as "fake news". Alternatives to any narrative have easily been thrown aside, no matter how cogent, no matter how real.

And not to forget the man at the top, Donald Trump, who has conducted the orchestra.

Maybe we all prefer a comforting lie to the truth. But reality bites in the end, though I fear that after a lifetime of jeering at losers it is beyond Mr Trump's capacity to accept defeat. All he now has is the belief that only a battle has been lost, not the war. Alas, four more combative years before he seeks once again the Republican nomination.
gakINGKONG On about 22 hours ago




, Florida
#4New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 12:57:39
It's a different type of cultural divide but if you remember algor and the hanging Chads in Florida and if you remember Senator Clinton provided she did concede but then started suing and there was four years of Russia collusion it is very seldom that there is a very neat clean uncontested election. But if the TFS is a microcosm of the culture at large then just remember there are tons of people that disagree on the outside just as it happens on this very forum
dookie On about 7 hours ago
Foolish Bombu





, United Kingdom
#5New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 14:35:48
@gakINGKONG Said

it is very seldom that there is a very neat clean uncontested election



Well, that is true. However, the sheer scale of denial and worse, apparent total rejection of the result by so many, is unprecedented as far as I am aware.
mrmhead On about 4 hours ago




NE, Ohio
#6New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 14:50:36
Florida alone would have made a difference.
Several states, by thousands of votes needs to change to make a difference for 2020.

It was the trumpsterf***s that kept crying about "No Collusion" while the investigation was looking into Interference.
There is a difference, but many choose to remain ignorant.
DiscordTiger On about 5 hours ago
The Queen of Random

Administrator




Emerald City, United States (g
#7New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 17:42:35
I don’t understand either.

I mean it was close yes, but not close enough that people should be this delusional.

I get them needing a safe space and complaining and s***, but the complete denial of reality is just weird.

In people I thought were otherwise reasonable.
Leon On about 4 hours ago




San Diego, California
#8New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 22:26:40
@dookie Said

Part, as I see it, of a general malaise in our current world. "Everyone is entitled to their opinion" has become "any opinion is as good as another" irrespective of the weight of corroborating support.

More, there have been four years of any "alternative reality" being discounted as "fake news". Alternatives to any narrative have easily been thrown aside, no matter how cogent, no matter how real.

And not to forget the man at the top, Donald Trump, who has conducted the orchestra.

Maybe we all prefer a comforting lie to the truth. But reality bites in the end, though I fear that after a lifetime of jeering at losers it is beyond Mr Trump's capacity to accept defeat. All he now has is the belief that only a battle has been lost, not the war. Alas, four more combative years before he seeks once again the Republican nomination.


I’ve given this much thought in the past several hours, and I think it comes down to religion to be honest. Let me explain.

Religion began as a way to explain the unexplainable, which is why we at once worshiped the sun, turned constellations into divine beings, thought the heavens rotated around the earth, and believed we were created from dust and a rib. But as science explained away most of these things, some beliefs yet still remained. While some of this was because unexplainable things remain, religion is hard to break even in the light of such science when it is tied up into doctrine, morality, and fears, particularly when people remain uneducated in science. And to add to that, we have a long history of rulers and governments that also use religion to tap the passion of voters and their support, a practice that is as almost as old as religion itself.

Abrahamic religions in particular continue to follow this for the most part, and in them we are taught things that cannot be proven or even seen, and probably never will be. The very idea itself that there is a single omnipotent being that is orchestrating everything requires complete faith rather than a belief based on scientific data. Then you add in belief in intervention & miracles, scripture & doctrine, heaven & hell, and it gets wholly sidetracked into a complete belief system that runs, at the very least, parallel to science, if not, at times, contrary to it.

In the USA in the past few decades, it is the Republican Party that has catered to our evangelical (which is a modern version of Biblical literalism/fundamentalism) Christian base, and with it, an overhwelming majority of its followers. Therefore, the Republican Party is the one that has a body of followers that puts a belief system that is apart from science on top of their mindset, whereas the Democratic Party is the one that has a larger body of followers that do not. And if you have a group of people that are more prone to believing in this alternate reality outside of science, you have a group of people that can be more open to believing things that can be made up apart from facts and data when and if they want to.

Enter Donald Trump. Trump was an problem as far as the evangelical Christian Right is concerned. Here we have a moralistic belief system that tells you not to lie, tells you not to commit adultery, among other sins, and it was obvious to everyone with an impartial mindset that not only was Trump openly doing these things, but he was not going to confess about it. Christians could obviously jump ship and not vote for him, problem solved. However, due to several decades at this point of being catered by the Republican Party resulting in abortion and gay rights becoming a political issue as much as a religious issue, and resulting in things like climate change, immigration, and other issues being a religious issue as much as a political issue, Christians saw a greater sin in doing this. So instead, they had to compromise their beliefs in such a way as to make voting for and following Trump an acceptable practice, a lesser of two evils, a Cyrus-type situation, a denial, or a combination or other compromise - opening up a Pandora’s box of alternating what was already an alternate reality mindset to begin with. And 4 years later of following Trump and his constant lies and threats and casting the other side as evil, this grip of reality slipped further and further. It is no wonder why QAnon has taken off. And it probably is less surprising why people, en mass, are ready to accept wild theories at this point, no matter how much of it is simply made up manure, just to keep what they want rather than accept hard data-driven truth.

I was once an evangelical Christian, and grew up in it, believing in it wholeheartedly until I was deep into my twenties. What tore me apart from it however, was the additional scientific upbringing I had and a belief in the importance of the scientific method and data. I had an astronomer grandfather and mathematician father and they instilled in me this from an early age. And I am thankful for it. Eventually as I went through my own education, I began to see how each belief system was molded and had to step outside to see what was going on. However, not everyone is rooted in science. Many are simply brought up to believe in the primary importance in the religion of their parents and are not as encouraged to take as science seriously as I was, or even take it at all.
Leon On about 4 hours ago




San Diego, California
#9New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 22:46:59
@gakINGKONG Said

It's a different type of cultural divide but if you remember algor and the hanging Chads in Florida and if you remember Senator Clinton provided she did concede but then started suing and there was four years of Russia collusion it is very seldom that there is a very neat clean uncontested election. But if the TFS is a microcosm of the culture at large then just remember there are tons of people that disagree on the outside just as it happens on this very forum


There is no doubt that people contest results and try and rectify it in one way or another, at least to some degree, either directly, or indirectly. However, I’ve never see a case where a complete alternate reality is created and followed en masse to deny such a result.

Is there election fraud? Sure! Just as there has been in every election. How about rampant voter fraud that is on such a scale as to, not only overturn 15,000-150,000 vote leads, but do so in several states in a certain combination to overturn the victor? Well I guess so, as long as we are making s*** up without proof. In fact, anybody can say anything about anything without this proof or evidence. I can probably come up with some reasons the Dodgers didn’t actually win the World Series this year as long as I can do it in that manner.

There is a reason why past losers of elections didn’t though. Because elections are based on numbers. Data, facts. And people believed in them. Or used to. Until Trump. The fact that he was spouting off about fraud before anyone even cast the first tally mark should have been a giveaway that this was going to be a manufactured reality, but apparently it wasn’t.

All I can say then, is, congratulations, you’re an idiot.
DiscordTiger On about 5 hours ago
The Queen of Random

Administrator




Emerald City, United States (g
#10New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 23:17:07
@Leon Said

I’ve given this much thought in the past several hours, and I think it comes down to religion to be honest. Let me explain.

Religion began as a way to explain the unexplainable, which is why we at once worshiped the sun, turned constellations into divine beings, thought the heavens rotated around the earth, and believed we were created from dust and a rib. But as science explained away most of these things, some beliefs yet still remained. While some of this was because unexplainable things remain, religion is hard to break even in the light of such science when it is tied up into doctrine, morality, and fears, particularly when people remain uneducated in science. And to add to that, we have a long history of rulers and governments that also use religion to tap the passion of voters and their support, a practice that is as almost as old as religion itself.

Abrahamic religions in particular continue to follow this for the most part, and in them we are taught things that cannot be proven or even seen, and probably never will be. The very idea itself that there is a single omnipotent being that is orchestrating everything requires complete faith rather than a belief based on scientific data. Then you add in belief in intervention & miracles, scripture & doctrine, heaven & hell, and it gets wholly sidetracked into a complete belief system that runs, at the very least, parallel to science, if not, at times, contrary to it.

In the USA in the past few decades, it is the Republican Party that has catered to our evangelical (which is a modern version of Biblical literalism/fundamentalism) Christian base, and with it, an overhwelming majority of its followers. Therefore, the Republican Party is the one that has a body of followers that puts a belief system that is apart from science on top of their mindset, whereas the Democratic Party is the one that has a larger body of followers that do not. And if you have a group of people that are more prone to believing in this alternate reality outside of science, you have a group of people that can be more open to believing things that can be made up apart from facts and data when and if they want to.

Enter Donald Trump. Trump was an problem as far as the evangelical Christian Right is concerned. Here we have a moralistic belief system that tells you not to lie, tells you not to commit adultery, among other sins, and it was obvious to everyone with an impartial mindset that not only was Trump openly doing these things, but he was not going to confess about it. Christians could obviously jump ship and not vote for him, problem solved. However, due to several decades at this point of being catered by the Republican Party resulting in abortion and gay rights becoming a political issue as much as a religious issue, and resulting in things like climate change, immigration, and other issues being a religious issue as much as a political issue, Christians saw a greater sin in doing this. So instead, they had to compromise their beliefs in such a way as to make voting for and following Trump an acceptable practice, a lesser of two evils, a Cyrus-type situation, a denial, or a combination or other compromise - opening up a Pandora’s box of alternating what was already an alternate reality mindset to begin with. And 4 years later of following Trump and his constant lies and threats and casting the other side as evil, this grip of reality slipped further and further. It is no wonder why QAnon has taken off. And it probably is less surprising why people, en mass, are ready to accept wild theories at this point, no matter how much of it is simply made up manure, just to keep what they want rather than accept hard data-driven truth.

I was once an evangelical Christian, and grew up in it, believing in it wholeheartedly until I was deep into my twenties. What tore me apart from it however, was the additional scientific upbringing I had and a belief in the importance of the scientific method and data. I had an astronomer grandfather and mathematician father and they instilled in me this from an early age. And I am thankful for it. Eventually as I went through my own education, I began to see how each belief system was molded and had to step outside to see what was going on. However, not everyone is rooted in science. Many are simply brought up to believe in the primary importance in the religion of their parents and are not as encouraged to take as science seriously as I was, or even take it at all.



religion and patriotism has been a cornerstone of the republican party since the 50's to keep "others" out. Others being non- WASPs Now the catholics are brought in with the religion as they are close enough to the evangelicals, but its a certain type of catholic that is acceptable.

I mean the evangelicals in the 80's made a big push in the party, but there were makings of the divide even before that, with mccarthyism and other events around that time.
Leon On about 4 hours ago




San Diego, California
#11New Post! Nov 12, 2020 @ 23:34:49
@DiscordTiger Said

religion and patriotism has been a cornerstone of the republican party since the 50's to keep "others" out. Others being non- WASPs Now the catholics are brought in with the religion as they are close enough to the evangelicals, but its a certain type of catholic that is acceptable.

I mean the evangelicals in the 80's made a big push in the party, but there were makings of the divide even before that, with mccarthyism and other events around that time.


Yes, the red scare, with the threat of communism and it’s anti-organized religion philosophy, definitely helped bring the two, together as well as the migration of Southern Democrats to the other side due to the Civil Rights movement in the 60’s and 70’s. But I was mainly thinking of how it really cemented and took off afterwards under Reagan and beyond - the Moral Majority/Religious Right began around then.
gakINGKONG On about 22 hours ago




, Florida
#13New Post! Nov 13, 2020 @ 00:49:59
@Leon Said

There is no doubt that people contest results and try and rectify it in one way or another, at least to some degree, either directly, or indirectly. However, I’ve never see a case where a complete alternate reality is created and followed en masse to deny such a result.

Is there election fraud? Sure! Just as there has been in every election. How about rampant voter fraud that is on such a scale as to, not only overturn 15,000-150,000 vote leads, but do so in several states in a certain combination to overturn the victor? Well I guess so, as long as we are making s*** up without proof. In fact, anybody can say anything about anything without this proof or evidence. I can probably come up with some reasons the Dodgers didn’t actually win the World Series this year as long as I can do it in that manner.

There is a reason why past losers of elections didn’t though. Because elections are based on numbers. Data, facts. And people believed in them. Or used to. Until Trump. The fact that he was spouting off about fraud before anyone even cast the first tally mark should have been a giveaway that this was going to be a manufactured reality, but apparently it wasn’t.

All I can say then, is, congratulations, you’re an idiot.


Taking that in the spirit it was given. Say hello to your mother for me.
Leon On about 4 hours ago




San Diego, California
#14New Post! Nov 13, 2020 @ 02:23:11
@gakINGKONG Said

Taking that in the spirit it was given. Say hello to your mother for me.


Are you participating in the DC MAGA riot Saturday?
chaski On 28 minutes ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#15New Post! Nov 13, 2020 @ 04:41:49
@gakINGKONG Said


...it is very seldom that there is a very neat clean uncontested election...



Bull s***.

Typical Republican/Conservative revisionist history.

The vast majority of elections in the USA have been uncontested.

For president, In 53 of the 58 total elections held so far (about 91 percent), the winner of the national popular vote has also carried the Electoral College vote. Only 5 presidents have been elected without winning both the popular and EC vote.

There have only been 4 truly contested elections... until now.
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