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adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#211New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 20:50:51
firstly i've voted for parties other then dems and pubs throughout my whole adulthood. Never once buying into the "they're not viable, there's no point". Secondly I never say that phrase. Ever. I understand why things arent viable, and why they dont become viable and i dont feed that. I actually talk about third parties when im talking politics. tfs used to be much better about this, but from what i read last night, this has become a very one sided haven. Which is fine, we all deserve a place, right? Dont get me wrong, if either dems or pubs put someone forward worth a damn they'd get my vote. But it;s been a long time since they did that. So basically instead of closing my mind to the possibility, i've kept it open, and advocate it every time i can, rather then fall back on the cop out "it's not viable" argument. even though it has a lot of truth at this moment in time.
chaski On about 5 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#212New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:00:49
@adrinachrome Said

I mean in the way that people said votiong for gary johnson was the same thing as voting for donald trump in 2016, i didnt ever say you did say that, it was just to reinforce the anti two party mindset.



I don't think I said that (if I did I was in error).

Gary was (still is I guess) a Libertarian. Not many votes went that way, however Libertarianism is closer (politically speaking) to being a Republican. So, those votes were never going to go to a Democrat anyway.

On the other hand, I know some people who were Bernie supporters who opted to vote Libertarian. Their votes were essentially votes for Trump. Why? Because looking at the political spectrum they were closer idealistically to the Democrats (Hillary as it turns out) than the Republicans (Trump). Had the voted closer to their political beliefs (and Bernie), they would have voted for Hillary... thus they voted against their own political beliefs helped Trump.

Similarly as Trump said in an interview, so many black voters stayed away from the polls that it helped him get elected. That is, Trump realized that mathematically the black vote that normally would have gone Democrat was absent and that helped him... essentially these were Trump votes.
adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#213New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:01:40
We probably agree on this one, but i dont think any vote you cast should ever be used as a protest vote. You should always look at the available candidates and the decide who most aligns with you. And if that isnt a dem or pub, and you decide that it would be a waste to vote for them but instead vote for a dem of pub... well now, if that's not voting for someone so that someone else doesn't win, what is?
adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#214New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:03:04
@chaski Said

I don't think I said that (if I did I was in error).

Gary was (still is I guess) a Libertarian. Not many votes went that way, however Libertarianism is closer (politically speaking) to being a Republican. So, those votes were never going to go to a Democrat anyway.

On the other hand, I know some people who were Bernie supporters who opted to vote Libertarian. Their votes were essentially votes for Trump. Why? Because looking at the political spectrum they were closer idealistically to the Democrats (Hillary as it turns out) than the Republicans (Trump). Had the voted closer to their political beliefs (and Bernie), they would have voted for Hillary... thus they voted against their own political beliefs helped Trump.

Similarly as Trump said in an interview, so many black voters stayed away from the polls that it helped him get elected. That is, Trump realized that mathematically the black vote that normally would have gone Democrat was absent and that helped him... essentially these were Trump votes.


FIGURED IT OUT


I like libertarians to an extent. My biggest problem is that the libertarians i know personally are all very well off, and dont have a lifestyle that represents the majority of US citizens.
chaski On about 5 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#215New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:06:03
@adrinachrome Said

firstly i've voted for parties other then dems and pubs throughout my whole adulthood. Never once buying into the "they're not viable, there's no point". Secondly I never say that phrase. Ever. I understand why things arent viable, and why they dont become viable and i dont feed that. I actually talk about third parties when im talking politics. tfs used to be much better about this, but from what i read last night, this has become a very one sided haven. Which is fine, we all deserve a place, right? Dont get me wrong, if either dems or pubs put someone forward worth a damn they'd get my vote. But it;s been a long time since they did that. So basically instead of closing my mind to the possibility, i've kept it open, and advocate it every time i can, rather then fall back on the cop out "it's not viable" argument. even though it has a lot of truth at this moment in time.


Edit

A potentially more viable option with a potentially greater impact would be to always vote whoever is in office out... always vote them out.... i.e. vote for the opposite political party.

Many elections are close enough that if all the third party voters and "I'm not voting" people would likely result in many politicians getting voted out of office. If enough got voted out, sooner or later they would try to find a solution... which might be the creation of a third viable party.
adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#216New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:07:12
Thats still a doodoo reason chaski. Unless they voted as a protest as you called it then they voted who they felt should win. which is in my mind the right way to go about it. Although when i speak voting im 90% talking local/state. I'd like to see what the electoral collage would do if a 3rd party won the popular. pretty sure the presidential election is firmly in the two parties hands and would have to be changed from the state level first.
adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#217New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:09:00
@chaski Said

Edit

A potentially more viable option with a potentially greater impact would be to always vote whoever is in office out... always vote them out.... i.e. vote for the opposite political party.

Many elections are close enough that if all the third party voters and "I'm not voting" people would likely result in many politicians getting voted out of office. If enough got voted out, sooner or later they would try to find a solution... which might be the creation of a third viable party.



I understand that it's the way it is, and i know i been gone a long time but i dont remember you being toooooooo big an a*****e :P so i know that all this is just talk really. But it is the way it is, and until people change the way they think it will remain the way it is. also I care about the way i vote, which is the most important part.
adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#218New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:09:22
i figurred it out and i still messed it up
chaski On about 5 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#219New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:11:26
@adrinachrome Said

I'd like to see what the electoral collage would do if a 3rd party won the popular.



It really has to start at the state level.

A 3rd party needs to become viable at the state voting (state legislature/governor) level.

Then it could take hold.

They don't even have to win the governorship, nor the presidency.

If a 3rd party had even 25% of a handful of states (CA, NY, PA... and 3 or 4 others) their political voice would be considerable.
chaski On about 5 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#220New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:13:04
@adrinachrome Said

i dont remember you being toooooooo big an a*****e :P s


Long term memory failing you!
adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#221New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:13:25
I think in my 37feelslikea1000 years on this planet i've never seen a time in the us more ripe for the rise of another party.
adrinachrome On September 06, 2020




Fukitall, Arizona
#222New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:14:36
anyway ill keep comong back on this site to post opposite arguments but for now i gotta do growed up things
chaski On about 5 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#223New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:18:45
@adrinachrome Said

... rise of another party.


That was my hope from Bernie.

I never though he could beat Trump... but start a Third party... the time was ripe in 2017... it might just have stuck.

right now there are a lot of middle of the road Republicans that could do it... they are, apparently, afraid of Trump and Mitch and the far right.

After this election, maybe Bernie will sit down with some of the more far left Democrats and try to start something new.... that could lead to the more centrist Dems reaching out to the more centrist Republicans.

That could, in theory, lead to three parties (left, center, right).... that could even be the boost Libertarians need to build on for a 4th party...

Of course the lobbies have a strangle hold on the whole thing, so making lobbying illegal would help.
DiscordTiger On 24 minutes ago
The Queen of Random

Administrator




Emerald City, United States (g
#224New Post! Aug 22, 2020 @ 21:20:30
Gary Johnson is a republican who likes pot and doesn’t hate gay people.

I don’t mind Gary. He did good things in my state.

Doesn’t have enough support to get there. Though if he pulled a Bernie. He might of had a better chance
chaski On about 5 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#225New Post! Aug 23, 2020 @ 01:44:08
And now his sister has walked away....

"Maryanne Trump Barry, who was serving as a federal judge at the time, made the slashing comments to her niece Mary Trump, who was secretly recording her, the Post reported. At one point, Barry was discussing Trump’s moves in 2018 to separate immigrant children from their parents.

“All he wants to do is appeal to his base,” Barry said, according to the newspaper. “He has no principles. None. None. And his base, I mean, my God, if you were a religious person, you want to help people... not do this.”

She added: “His goddamned tweet and lying, oh my God,” she said. “I’m talking too freely, but you know, the change of stories, the lack of preparation, the lying...holy s***.”

Trump had earlier suggested on Fox News that he might “put her at the border” and assign his sister to make immigration decisions. She guessed he hadn’t read her decisions or he would know they wouldn’t likely agree on issues.

“What has he read?” Mary Trump asked her aunt. Barry responded: “He doesn’t read.”

At one point, an exasperated Barry said: “It’s the phoniness of it all. It’s the phoniness and this cruelty. Donald is cruel.”
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