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Those Calling For Impeachment...

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Leon On about 14 hours ago




San Diego, California
#1New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 21:28:01
...shut up.

The only purpose that impeachment proceedings would serve would be to rile up the other side and, therefore increase the chances of getting Trump re-elected.

Yes, investigations should still occur, but they should be for the sole purpose of getting transparency for the American voter and letting the voter give the final verdict on whether or not Trump should be re-elected.

Democrats should be open about this purpose. They need to put to bed any future talk of impeachment NOW, and say it simply will not happen, in taking away any potential fuel for Republicans to rile up their base. Democrats should instead focus on the issues for 2020 and beyond. The spectacle of impeachment proceedings will take away from that and divert media attention away from that, not to mention split the party base, which should remain in lockstep on everything. Trump would get drunk in glee over any discord between Dems.

Besides, the Senate would acquit him.

And, besides, even if the Senate somehow got their spine back and removed him, chances are it would occur close to the election anyways.

And, besides, even if the investigations were miraculously wrapped up much quicker and impeachment proceedings occurred a lot sooner, and the Senate learned conviction a lot faster, we would just have Mike Pence in charge.
bob_the_fisherman On 29 minutes ago
Anatidaephobic





, Angola
#2New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 21:37:43
@Leon Said

not to mention split the party base, which should remain in lockstep on everything.


This is not a specific comment on this issue, but an aside on this

The west started to go horribly, horribly wrong when this became a genuinely held belief.

Politicians are there to represent in order, the people of their electorate, the state they're from, the nation, the interest of all people globally, their political party.

Somehow that order got reversed.
Leon On about 14 hours ago




San Diego, California
#3New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 21:40:30
@bob_the_fisherman Said

This is not a specific comment on this issue, but an aside on this

The west started go horribly, horribly wrong, when this became a genuinely held belief.

Politicians are there to represent, in order, the people of their electorate, the state they're from, the nation, the interest of all people globally, their political party.

Somehow that order got reversed.


Normally I’d agree with you, but, this time, I think it is more important that we got the person currently in charge out than it is whoever replaces him, and so it will take some unity to accomplish that. I have no problem, really, with whoever wins the DNC primary, as they all are similar enough on the issues that I care most about.
DiscordTiger On about 4 hours ago
The Queen of Random

Administrator




Emerald City, United States (g
#4New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 21:43:45
IM only in favor of impeachment if Pence goes too....Which is not going to happen so not even worth it. Also impeachment doesn't even guarantee removal of office.

I still want to have the investigation finished though.
DiscordTiger On about 4 hours ago
The Queen of Random

Administrator




Emerald City, United States (g
#5New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 21:46:23
I also agree that as a party, we Democrats need to act a little more like the GOP and understand we back our candidate in the final race.
bob_the_fisherman On 29 minutes ago
Anatidaephobic





, Angola
#6New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 21:48:56
@Leon Said

Normally I’d agree with you, but, this time, I think it is more important that we got the person currently in charge out than it is whoever replaces him, and so it will take some unity to accomplish that. I have no problem, really, with whoever wins the DNC primary, as they all are similar enough on the issues that I care most about.


I'll return the favor from the previous thread here (although you can answer there if you don't want to derail this thread). Why the desperation to get Trump out? Why is he so bad?
Leon On about 14 hours ago




San Diego, California
#7New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 21:56:13
@bob_the_fisherman Said

I'll return the favor from the previous thread here (although you can answer there if you don't want to derail this thread). Why the desperation to get Trump out? Why is he so bad?


Climate denial is the main thing. Not a fan of the tax cuts either. Complete disregard for our debt. Complete disregard for foreign influence on our democratic process. Complete disregard for the swamp in Washington (despite promises, he is turning out to be part of the swamp). Attempts at health care reform a disaster (he had no solution anyways). Scapegoating of illegal immigrants for real problems. Habitual liar and untruthful to the American people. Supporter of ruthless, totalitarian dictators. Nepotism. Moral degenerate. And so on...

Worst president in US history, by far.
mrmhead On about 7 hours ago




NE, Ohio
#8New Post! Mar 07, 2019 @ 23:28:53
@bob_the_fisherman Said

I'll return the favor from the previous thread here (although you can answer there if you don't want to derail this thread). Why the desperation to get Trump out? Why is he so bad?


Because he really doesn't know what the f*** he is doing with regards to leading a nation and he is too arrogant to take advice of those who do, much less keep them on staff.

He acts like he just bought a toy company that he can screw around with for a few years and then dump it, not caring about the future beyond his personal interests, and those of his crony stockholders.
chaski On about 7 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#9New Post! Mar 08, 2019 @ 01:01:34
@mrmhead Said

Because he really doesn't know what the f*** he is doing with regards to leading a nation and he is too arrogant to take advice of those who do, much less keep them on staff.



You mean Trump doesn't know more than 17 US intelligence agencies, the Department of Justice, the State Department, and virtually all of the senior military flag officers?

But... but... he has repeatedly told us he knows more than any of them... and is going to tell us "next Tuesday" the details...

(of course "next Tuesday" is like "tomorrow"... it never comes.)


PS

I agree with Leon: Everyone (especially FoxNews and all Republicans/conservatives) should shut up about impeachment. Even if it happened, it would be irrelevant.
mrmhead On about 7 hours ago




NE, Ohio
#10New Post! Mar 08, 2019 @ 01:42:28
@chaski Said

PS

I agree with Leon: Everyone (especially FoxNews and all Republicans/conservatives) should shut up about impeachment. Even if it happened, it would be irrelevant.



Yes, I do too - I just didn't get to reply to that part yet because I had a chance to spew my Trump hatred....

But YES,
(big) IF he does get removed, we'd end up with Pence.
Would Pence be worthy of a 2020 run? Where has he been? He's been as ghostly as his white hair.

However, would a failed attempt of impeachment disqualify Trump from running in 2020?
I think a looming felony would be better, but he's surrounded himself with "Sitting Presidents Can't be Tried" minions.

I think that is the Dems only play right now - Disqualify him. Because there is no way to sway the Trump base, and the GOPers are mostly playing the lock-step game still.

But if he gets disqualified, the GOPers would be in disarray (prime opportunity for Kasich) and the Dems could run Bozo the Clown (wait ... where have I heard that before?)


(I might not be done, but I gotta run)

But Generally I agree STFU!!!
Leon On about 14 hours ago




San Diego, California
#11New Post! Mar 08, 2019 @ 02:27:11
@mrmhead Said

Yes, I do too - I just didn't get to reply to that part yet because I had a chance to spew my Trump hatred....

But YES,
(big) IF he does get removed, we'd end up with Pence.
Would Pence be worthy of a 2020 run? Where has he been? He's been as ghostly as his white hair.

However, would a failed attempt of impeachment disqualify Trump from running in 2020?
I think a looming felony would be better, but he's surrounded himself with "Sitting Presidents Can't be Tried" minions.

I think that is the Dems only play right now - Disqualify him. Because there is no way to sway the Trump base, and the GOPers are mostly playing the lock-step game still.

But if he gets disqualified, the GOPers would be in disarray (prime opportunity for Kasich) and the Dems could run Bozo the Clown (wait ... where have I heard that before?)


(I might not be done, but I gotta run)

But Generally I agree STFU!!!


Not only can Trump run again if an impeachment attempt fails to pass the Senate, but he could run again even if removed from office. The Senate would need to impose an additional penalty of disallowing him from running for any future office on top of removing him from his current office to disallow him from running again.
Leon On about 14 hours ago




San Diego, California
#12New Post! Mar 08, 2019 @ 02:31:42
@chaski Said

PS

I agree with Leon: Everyone (especially FoxNews and all Republicans/conservatives) should shut up about impeachment. Even if it happened, it would be irrelevant.


The right certainly won’t shut up about it. Which is why the Democratic leaders need to take the initiative on this in putting the idea to bed, and need to do it now.
Cpat92 On about 2 hours ago
It's all or nothing





Lauderhill, Florida
#13New Post! Mar 08, 2019 @ 02:32:48
Once Trump is gone, then maybe we'll have more competent people on both sides going for President.
Jennifer1984 On about 11 hours ago
Remoaner and proud





Penzance, United Kingdom
#14New Post! Mar 08, 2019 @ 16:19:38
As I understand things here....

Trump could be in serious trouble with the law, but has a get out of jail free card because he can give himself a Presidential pardon, is that right...?

However, this only applies to Federal charges... yes...?

He cannot pardon himself though from charges brought by individual States, is that correct...?

So.. if any individual State brings charges against Trump, it is possible that he could wind up in chokey, correct...?

Thanks in advance for either clarifying my understanding or telling me that I'm wrong on every level..!!
.
I'm just trying to figure out how things might progress
chaski On about 7 hours ago
Stalker





Tree at Floydgirrl's Window,
#15New Post! Mar 08, 2019 @ 16:53:11
@Jennifer1984 Said

As I understand things here....

Trump could be in serious trouble with the law, but has a get out of jail free card because he can give himself a Presidential pardon, is that right...?

However, this only applies to Federal charges... yes...?

He cannot pardon himself though from charges brought by individual States, is that correct...?

So.. if any individual State brings charges against Trump, it is possible that he could wind up in chokey, correct...?

Thanks in advance for either clarifying my understanding or telling me that I'm wrong on every level..!!
.
I'm just trying to figure out how things might progress




Trump could be in serious trouble with the law, but has a get out of jail free card because he can give himself a Presidential pardon, is that right...?

This is actually debatable. No U.S. president has ever pardoned himself. Thus it has never been tested by our supreme court. The wording in our constitution isn't clear. People on both sides of the issue will say that it is clear, but that is because they are reading what they want to read and believing what they want to believe.

Bottom line: A president, in this example Trump, would have to test the system. Then we will find out.

However, this only applies to Federal charges... yes...?

Yes. Trump can only pardon for Federal crimes. So, if he can pardon himself it wouldn't block state level crimes; like crime in the Southern District of New York.

He cannot pardon himself though from charges brought by individual States, is that correct...?

Correct.

So.. if any individual State brings charges against Trump, it is possible that he could wind up in chokey, correct...?

Correct.


Note: A president cannot pardon himself from impeachment by the H.R., nor removal by the Senate.
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