Russian interference

@mrmhead Said

Am I missing something here, or is this Russian Interference stuff just an admittance that humans are gullible, and when you put important decisions in the hands of the gullible (aka Democracy), you run the risk of bad decisions.

So this places more importance on the control of information, or you have to have a tighter control of the leadership structure - those supposedly looking out for the better of the populace... at least in an "ideal" world.

Is it any different than propaganda on leaflets dropped from a plane?

Or loudspeakers blasting songs and speeches and whatnot over a border?

Is the Russian investigation just a "how did you beat me at our game" investigation?


I don't know, I'm not a scholar on this kind of stuff ...

That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Average Joe

@mrmhead Said

Challenge to Chaski: Reply as profusely as you often do, yet refrain from mentioning the name of he who should not be named!



I know you can do it, it's just that I probably tee'd up the OP for a grand-slam on he-who-should-not-be-named.

@chaski Said

A. Russia has been trying to f__k with the USA since WW2
B. Yes, the USA does "it" also.
C. However, just because countries F__k with each other, does not make it legal.... example: spying on the USA's military is illegal.

D. More importantly, while it is a given that Russia has (& other countries have) f__ked with the USA, the more important issue is that: It is illegal for U.S. citizens to help (i.e. conspire with... aka collude with) any other country in their efforts to F__k with the USA.

E. It is also illegal for anyone to get foreign help in obtaining federal political election and/or appointment.

So.. Is the Russian investigation just a "how did you beat me at our game" investigation?

NO.

The Russia investigation is about:
1. What exactly did Russia do relative to the 2016 presidential election?
2. Did anyone in the USA assist Russia do whatever they did?
3. What was the impact of #1 & #2?

Note: Whenever a federal criminal investigation is being conducted, it is common for evidence of other crimes to surface. Examples:
> A real estate banking fraud investigation might lead to a drug money laundering investigation.
> A corporate embezzlement investigation might lead to a federal government contract fraud investigations.
> An investigation into what if anything Russia did in an effort to f__k with a U.S. election, might lead to an investigation into U.S. citizens illegally accepting money from Russia (think Flynn).
> Etc.

So...

Is the Russia investigation new, surprising or unusual: NO.
Does the fact that it happens all the time mean that "we" should ignore it: NO.
Does the fact that the president of the USA, clearly, had some friends who have plead guilty to crimes and other friends who have been indicted and are presently standing trial for illegal activity mean that the president of the USA himself did anything illegal: No.

Guilty by association is not a crime.

On the other hand, one might wonder why the president is constantly calling the investigation into what exactly Russia did or did not do (and which Americans, if any helped) a "Witch Hunt". A smarter (innocent?) president would want to uphold our Constitution and let the investigation find the facts... all of the facts.

But only very naive people have ever accused our president of being very smart.

@Ghyda Said
The point I want to make: The United States has a complicated system of elections. One wonders how the Russians could tailor their propaganda in a way that could effect the elections

Paul Johnson on CSpan .

@mrmhead Said


It's not like they hacked into the voting system and changed actual votes.

They just hacked into voters minds ....

@Ghyda Said

I read in an American History book A History of the American People by Paul Johnson that the United States has more than 10,000 elections every year. I'm not sure that I have quoted a correct number, but Johnson insists that the United States has more elections than any other country.

By election, I think he means every contest from dog catcher to president. So the presidential election would not be one election, but maybe 1000 elections.

Johnson takes a more or less conservative view of American history. For example, he doesn't grouse about Sacco and Vanzetti, and he doesn't even mention Samuel Insull.

The point I want to make: The United States has a complicated system of elections. One wonders how the Russians could tailor their propaganda in a way that could effect the elections

Paul Johnson on CSpan .

@Ghyda Said


By election, I think he means every contest from dog catcher to president.