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Ron Paul wants to eliminate federal student loans

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drman321 On December 28, 2013




, Florida
#76New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 18:20:11
@Lili Said

That was before Obama withdrew student loan subsidies from the banks. No one is getting $10,000 per semester now. So one would think that tuition should have already started dropping. Has it?



I don't know, has it?
Lili On July 12, 2019
....................





Sunshine Land,
#77New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 18:37:42
@jonnythan Said

Now we're reaching the same page, from different sides of the book: the education system is sub-optimal.

The federal government is enabling enormous amounts of waste at the undergraduate level and stiffing new grads and dropouts with the bill. Undergrad degrees should never cost as much as they do, anywhere - and that is largely thanks to the federal government happily letting them all drink from the guaranteed money fountain.



You know what education structure I think is awesome? Apprenticeships. You get paid while learning about the job you want. And the companies that train you get to tailor their education to the current needs of the field. There's no delay between real-world needs and classroom structure inconsistencies, or waiting for textbook manufacturers to catch up. And there's no tuition! At all!
jonnythan On August 02, 2014
Bringer of rad mirth


Deleted



Here and there,
#78New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 18:39:24
@Lili Said

You know what education structure I think is awesome? Apprenticeships. You get paid while learning about the job you want. And the companies that train you get to tailor their education to the current needs of the field. There's no delay between real-world needs and classroom structure inconsistencies, or waiting for textbook manufacturers to catch up. And there's no tuition! At all!


See? Now you're thinking outside the box, imagining innovative ways the private sector could adjust itself for life without government subsidies of massively inflated college tuitions!
Lili On July 12, 2019
....................





Sunshine Land,
#79New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 18:50:26
@jonnythan Said

See? Now you're thinking outside the box, imagining innovative ways the private sector could adjust itself for life without government subsidies of massively inflated college tuitions!



I like the principle of it, but is it realistically scalable though? Is the private sector able to absorb that many apprentices? A journalist can't reasonably have 20 newbies following her around with notepads, for example?
drman321 On December 28, 2013




, Florida
#80New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 18:54:17
@Lili Said

I like the principle of it, but is it realistically scalable though? Is the private sector able to absorb that many apprentices? A journalist can't reasonably have 20 newbies following her around with notepads, for example?



Nope the journalist would get 1 newbie following her around and 19 people who didn't get the apprenticeship and went back to the drawing board.
jonnythan On August 02, 2014
Bringer of rad mirth


Deleted



Here and there,
#81New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 18:55:03
@Lili Said

I like the principle of it, but is it realistically scalable though? Is the private sector able to absorb that many apprentices? A journalist can't reasonably have 20 newbies following her around with notepads, for example?


Why 20? Does every journalist need 20 kids to take over her job when she retires or moves into management?

And why would no one suddenly get a degree?

I think that your idea of apprenticeship is a good one. We're not talking about some massive influx due to closing down all the colleges.. we're talking about a relatively small number of people who don't need to or choose not to spend 4 years in a university setting.
someone_else On August 30, 2012
Not a dude.


Deleted



American Alps, Washington
#82New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 18:58:31
@jonnythan Said

Why 20? Does every journalist need 20 kids to take over her job when she retires or moves into management?

And why would no one suddenly get a degree?

I think that your idea of apprenticeship is a good one. We're not talking about some massive influx due to closing down all the colleges.. we're talking about a relatively small number of people who don't need to or choose not to spend 4 years in a university setting.



Whenever I think of apprenticeships, I think of things like painting, plumbing, electrical, welding, etc...

Those are jobs that don't require a whole lot of formal education, they mostly take doing the job while being supervised to learn how to do it. Some extra courses here and there could help, but they don't have to all be learned at once for you to effectively do your job.
Lili On July 12, 2019
....................





Sunshine Land,
#83New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 19:01:38
@jonnythan Said

Why 20? Does every journalist need 20 kids to take over her job when she retires or moves into management?

And why would no one suddenly get a degree?

I think that your idea of apprenticeship is a good one. We're not talking about some massive influx due to closing down all the colleges.. we're talking about a relatively small number of people who don't need to or choose not to spend 4 years in a university setting.



true
Lili On July 12, 2019
....................





Sunshine Land,
#84New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 19:07:56
@someone_else Said

Whenever I think of apprenticeships, I think of things like painting, plumbing, electrical, welding, etc...

Those are jobs that don't require a whole lot of formal education, they mostly take doing the job while being supervised to learn how to do it. Some extra courses here and there could help, but they don't have to all be learned at once for you to effectively do your job.



Last time I checked there were actually over 800 officially catalogued "apprenticeable" careers.
boobagins On August 03, 2013
SPICY HOT TAMALES





Astral Weeks, Florida
#85New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 20:04:17
But don't we have apprenticeship type deals?

Federal Work Study - all uni and colleges have this.

High schools all have a work study program.

And the two year technical degrees do a hybrid study of a degree with real work experience.
jonnythan On August 02, 2014
Bringer of rad mirth


Deleted



Here and there,
#86New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 20:10:48
Work study has nothing to do with apprenticeship. It's usually just menial labor.
DiscordTiger On about 6 hours ago
The Queen of Random

Administrator




Emerald City, United States (g
#87New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 20:18:15
Work study is good if you plan to stay in the university environment, but mostly its just a paycheck to pay for food and rent.
boobagins On August 03, 2013
SPICY HOT TAMALES





Astral Weeks, Florida
#88New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 20:22:16
@jonnythan Said

Work study has nothing to do with apprenticeship. Its usually just menial labor.



I'd have to disagree. I know several that participated in programs geared towards their major or choice of career.

My brother did work study under the Department of Transportation in the engineering department when he was in high school. As soon as he graduated high school, he got a promotion and was able to move up. He pursued engineering in school and worked at DOT at the same time as assistant to various project managers and engineers until he got his degrees. He then worked for DOT as an engineer for about four years before moving to the private sector.

I did work study at fire station as a first-responder when I was pursing my EMT in high school.
jonnythan On August 02, 2014
Bringer of rad mirth


Deleted



Here and there,
#89New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 20:31:01
That's the exception. Doing work study in anything even related to your field is sort of a bonus. It's not meant to be on the job training or anything.
boobagins On August 03, 2013
SPICY HOT TAMALES





Astral Weeks, Florida
#90New Post! Oct 24, 2011 @ 20:33:14
Well no, that's why I said, "type deals."


Apprenticeship in private sectors nowadays seem to be limited to the railroads, mining, welding etc., type that someone else said.
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