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Religion & Philosophy

Heaven and Hell

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gakINGKONG On about 4 hours ago




, Florida
#181New Post! Jan 04, 2019 @ 23:04:54
@Erimitus Said

The Bible went from Greek to Latin to German to other languages. Each translation was an interpretation. There are currently many different versions of the Books. Each version is an interpretation made by the author.



But it’s basically the same story. Starts off with Abraham and Moses and nomadic tribes And kingdoms. Ends with Jesus and the apostles and a apocalyptic vision.

Most of the versions deal with phraseology and semantics.
Electric_Banana On about 13 hours ago




, New Zealand
#182New Post! Jan 04, 2019 @ 23:28:39
@MisterX Said

1. This is pretty simple: is there one, a Heaven or Hell?
2. Are there people in each place?
3. Is Heaven good and Hell bad?

I know that it has been asked ad infinitum, but I am asking it again.
It is an article of your faith. no matter whether you answer yes or no.



American Horror Story and David Lynch have managed to capture the only thing, to me, that looks like a potential Hell

However some cultures resort to the dream realm as Bardo which holds spirits only temporarily until it's time to fart them back up again into a new shell.

Lynch reconned Hell is working a full time menial job producing erasers (or the like) only to come home to a newborn which is an abomination you fear or knowing a soul mate whom will never be at your side in Hell but rather every bleak theatre or party you attend in Hades will leave you to witness your significant other in the company of another.

The above isn't really demonstrative of wise or intelligent creator however; eternal destruction is much more practical and humane

Also

There's a story I'm told
We all live and let go
There is nothing to hold us.........
gakINGKONG On about 4 hours ago




, Florida
#183New Post! Jan 05, 2019 @ 02:38:41
@Electric_Banana Said

American Horror Story and David Lynch have managed to capture the only thing, to me, that looks like a potential Hell

However some cultures resort to the dream realm as Bardo which holds spirits only temporarily until it's time to fart them back up again into a new shell.

Lynch reconned Hell is working a full time menial job producing erasers (or the like) only to come home to a newborn which is an abomination you fear or knowing a soul mate whom will never be at your side in Hell but rather every bleak theatre or party you attend in Hades will leave you to witness your significant other in the company of another.

The above isn't really demonstrative of wise or intelligent creator however; eternal destruction is much more practical and humane

Also

There's a story I'm told
We all live and let go
There is nothing to hold us.........


Until the early 90s. Now the seatbelt law is ubiquitous. Go sit in your car and wear a seatbelt. Seatbelts. They hold you.
MisterX On December 03, 2019




Saint Petersburg,
#184New Post! Jan 06, 2019 @ 20:14:30
@mrmhead Said

Each time the bible is translated into a different language, it is interpreted.

I am agnostic about god. "If" there is one, I'm highly skeptical of how man has described him. Which puts his realms and actions even further from belief or acceptance.

I'm more likely to "believe" in Karma - what goes around comes around. But that is more situational than spiritual.

As for "Hell", the argument that "It says so in the bible" is not convincing for me. That's where I was going with my previous post.

Isn't arguing FOR the existence of Heaven and Hell rhetorical as well?



@Erimitus Said

The Bible went from Greek to Latin to German to other languages. Each translation was an interpretation. There are currently many different versions of the Books. Each version is an interpretation made by the author.


English Standard Version
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment.

If that verse is not true, if it is false, the Bible is false; which both of of you are implicitly saying, that the Bible is false.

I believe that there are angels in Hell, in chains, and with no light at all.
It is utter darkness and it is a prison for them, until they are cast into the Lake Of Fire. It is not hard to believe that, not for me.
MisterX On December 03, 2019




Saint Petersburg,
#185New Post! Jan 06, 2019 @ 20:17:17
@Electric_Banana Said

American Horror Story and David Lynch have managed to capture the only thing, to me, that looks like a potential Hell


The above isn't really demonstrative of wise or intelligent creator however; eternal destruction is much more practical and humane

Also

There's a story I'm told
We all live and let go
There is nothing to hold us.........

Electric Banana, see post above, there is an eternal death, in which the person or being is always aware of where they are. And they are in fire, and burning.
mrmhead On about 2 hours ago




NE, Ohio
#186New Post! Jan 06, 2019 @ 21:37:40
@MisterX Said

If that verse is not true, if it is false, the Bible is false; which both of of you are implicitly saying, that the Bible is false.


BINGO!!

... though I will give you that there do seem to be some historical references that are accurate.

But if you insist that I make a 100% binary decision of true or false, I will say false.
Erimitus On December 10, 2019




The mind of God, Antarctica
#187New Post! Jan 06, 2019 @ 22:35:23
@MisterX Said

English Standard Version
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment.

If that verse is not true, if it is false, the Bible is false; which both of of you are implicitly saying, that the Bible is false.

I believe that there are angels in Hell, in chains, and with no light at all.
It is utter darkness and it is a prison for them, until they are cast into the Lake Of Fire. It is not hard to believe that, not for me.



X: If that verse is not true
Then; the Bible is false;

E: I do not understand your reasoning. Please explain

X: you are implying that the Bible is false.
E: Some stories, as told by ancients who may have just eaten some kind of mushroom, are metaphorical i.e., neither true nor false.
E: you seem to have misinterpreted what I have said.


X: I believe that there are angels in Hell, in chains, and with no light at all. It is utter darkness and it is a prison for them, until they are cast into the Lake Of Fire. It is not hard to believe that, not for me
E: If you believe this literally then it is true for you. I respect your belief.
Erimitus On December 10, 2019




The mind of God, Antarctica
#188New Post! Jan 06, 2019 @ 22:40:02
Kong: Most of the versions deal with phraseology and semantics.

E: yes
Electric_Banana On about 13 hours ago




, New Zealand
#189New Post! Jan 07, 2019 @ 19:40:25
@MisterX Said

If that verse is not true, if it is false, the Bible is false; which both of of you are implicitly saying, that the Bible is false.



There is such a thing as having many good ideas to share while at the same time being wrong with a few of your ideas

The Bible doesn't have to ace everything for it's wisdom to have value to if you're finding some parables of value.

If you don't leave at least a 10% probability of being wrong about everything you'll never learn anything more.


@MisterX Said

Electric Banana, see post above, there is an eternal death, in which the person or being is always aware of where they are. And they are in fire, and burning.


Sounds to me like someone broke something then; otherwise it's time to pull up our pants and break out our artillery because we're being held by a sadistic tyrant.
MisterX On December 03, 2019




Saint Petersburg,
#190New Post! Jan 09, 2019 @ 20:59:25
@MisterX Said

English Standard Version
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment.

If that verse is not true, if it is false, the Bible is false; which both of of you are implicitly saying, that the Bible is false.



@MisterX Said

Electric Banana, see post above, there is an eternal death, in which the person or being is always aware of where they are. And they are in fire, and burning.


@mrmhead Said

BINGO!!

... though I will give you that there do seem to be some historical references that are accurate.

But if you insist that I make a 100% binary decision of true or false, I will say false.

You treat heavy things in a light manner--since if it is true, then you are doomed. I am not here to proselytize to you, but merely to present a belief that I have.

I have a Book to rely on, but you have nothing except your own opinion. I won't wish you good luck with that, and I would not want to be you on Judgement Day.

@Erimitus Said

X: If that verse is not true
Then; the Bible is false;

E: I do not understand your reasoning. Please explain

X: you are implying that the Bible is false.

E: Some stories, as told by ancients who may have just eaten some kind of mushroom, are metaphorical i.e., neither true nor false.
E: you seem to have misinterpreted what I have said.

X: I believe that there are angels in Hell, in chains, and with no light at all. It is utter darkness and it is a prison for them, until they are cast into the Lake Of Fire. It is not hard to believe that, not for me.

E: If you believe this literally then it is true for you. I respect your belief.


Lazy thinking, since if it is true for me, it would follow that it is true for you. There are angels in Hell right now, and it is true, irrespective of what you or I think.

@Electric_Banana Said

There is such a thing as having many good ideas to share while at the same time being wrong with a few of your ideas

The Bible doesn't have to ace everything for it's wisdom to have value to if you're finding some parables of value.

If you don't leave at least a 10% probability of being wrong about everything you'll never learn anything more.

Sounds to me like someone broke something then; otherwise it's time to pull up our pants and break out our artillery because we're being held by a sadistic tyrant.


Who is the sadistic tyrant that refer to? God?
mrmhead On about 2 hours ago




NE, Ohio
#191New Post! Jan 09, 2019 @ 21:20:45
@MisterX Said

You treat heavy things in a light manner--since if it is true, then you are doomed. I am not here to proselytize to you, but merely to present a belief that I have.

I have a Book to rely on, but you have nothing except your own opinion. I won't wish you good luck with that, and I would not want to be you on Judgement Day.



If one day I am standing in front of the pearly gates, I will admit that I was wrong and ask for forgiveness - and mean it.

So according to what I've heard, that's all I need because he is an all loving, forgiving god.

If he say's FU and sends me to hell anyways - well, then I'm still right - he ain't all you say he is.
MisterX On December 03, 2019




Saint Petersburg,
#192New Post! Jan 09, 2019 @ 21:38:14
@mrmhead Said

If one day I am standing in front of the pearly gates, I will admit that I was wrong and ask for forgiveness - and mean it.

So according to what I've heard, that's all I need because he is an all loving, forgiving god.

If he say's FU and sends me to hell anyways - well, then I'm still right - he ain't all you say he is.



You won't get forgiveness after death, Christianity has a methodology to it, and you have this life to decide the matter.

If you take that attitude with you to the grave, rest assured, you won't see the pearly gates. You are using an maxim that you don't even understand, for instance how many pearly gates are there? There are 12, now you know more than you did.
Erimitus On December 10, 2019




The mind of God, Antarctica
#193New Post! Jan 09, 2019 @ 21:59:16
That which is true to you, from your perspective, maynot be true for me from my perspective

True, in this context, is a correlation between cognitive representation and actuality. At least that is what I mean when I use the word true.

Piolet: What is truth?

Jesus: <<face palm>>



MisterX On December 03, 2019




Saint Petersburg,
#194New Post! Jan 09, 2019 @ 22:19:26
@Erimitus Said

That which is true to you, from your perspective, maynot be true for me from my perspective

True, in this context, is a correlation between cognitive representation and actuality. At least that is what I mean when I use the word true.

Piolet: What is truth?

Jesus: <<face palm>>



That is ridiculous, Jesus declared Himself to the Truth, and I believe Him. There is unchanging truth, such as 2+2=4, and nothing will ever change that.
You are palliating your soul with fiction.
Erimitus On December 10, 2019




The mind of God, Antarctica
#195New Post! Jan 09, 2019 @ 23:50:33
@MisterX Said

That is ridiculous, Jesus declared Himself to the Truth, and I believe Him. There is unchanging truth, such as 2+2=4, and nothing will ever change that.
You are palliating your soul with fiction.



John 18:38

Where in the Bible does it say that 2 + 2 = 4?


I don't have a soul, I am a soul.

I palliate with marijuana.

It is all fiction.
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