Can abortion be compared to other forms of historical genocide?

Right off the bat I'm going to apologize because I'm posting this question and I don't have the time to stick around to see where it goes. Feel free to have fun without me for awhile. I'll be back. 8)

https://www.blackgenocide.org/abortion.html

This link is necessary though I know that links are ignored alot of the time.

The points of comparision are interesting. There are several of them made between The Final Solution, Slavery, and Abortion. They are as follows:

1. Personhood is always redefined to exclude the intended victim class.

2. Genocide is often framed in the lanquage of "choice".

3. Victim class tends to be people who have what we want or who get in our way.

4. Victim class is often seen as a "disease" on society or as diseased themselves.

5. Resources are inadequate to care for intended victim class if they are allowed to live.

Abortion is most often viewed as a personal choice but are there overall consequences in our society for better or for worse. For Example, if I were a racist individual (I'm Not) I would be very happy with the fact that 35% of abortions take place among black women who make up 12% of the population.

no. it cant be compared. termination of pregnancy is because the pregnancy cant go ahead for whatever reason. be it unwanted, or for health reasons for the mother or the growing baby.

I'm making reference to the website BlackGenocide.org. There are other sources in regard to genocidal practices.

Point of comparision #3 is that the victim is unwanted. The Jews were unwanted and scape-goated because they had material wealth that the Nazi's wanted for themselves.

I personally feel that the plight of Native Americans demonstrates genocide better then slavery does but the next comparision is to slavery. The white slave owners wanted the material wealth afforded by the labor of slaves.

Abortion seems to disproportionately affect minorities and the poor. Are poor black people unwanted? What about the poor in general? Are we better off with out these people? Are poor black women who abort their offspring doing every one a favor?

Aborted children are unwanted because they get in the way of careers, a woman's right to choose, and sexual freedom. Children are thought of as impediments to acquiring material wealth and self-fulfillment. The woman who aborts an unwanted child gets a second chance by sacrificing the childs one chance at life. Maybe the child should be given an award posthumorously for making the ultimate sacrifice.

Point of comparision #4 is concerning health reasons. The Nazi's referred to Jews and others to be exterminated as bacilli and parasites. American scientist Benjamin Rush speculated that blacks were actually leprous, diseased whites in need of a cure. The unwanted, unborn child is analogized by Warren Hern as a disease best treated by abortion in his medical text book 'Abortion Practice'.

Occasionally a pregnancy does threaten the life of the mother but there may be treatment options available other then abortion. There is always the option of premature delivery over partial birth abortion. It is actually safer for the mother to deliver then to have the fetus retained in the uterus while it's skull is being collapsed.

Abortion is also referred to as racial suicide and the killing of ones own offspring could rightfully be considered as suicide once removed. It puts the individual and also the race of that individual at a disadvantage according to the biological imperative.

Maybe the attitude that abortion is genocidal is simply racist because it is in itself racially motivated.

well...i like to think of it this way


genocide is the systematic killing of those outside the womb.

abortion seems to be carried out by those who can afford it. usually the poor end up keeping the child.

if an abortion occurs, then the existence of that person was not meant to be. the world may not be a better place without them, but would not be a worse place.

if hitler, sadam, etc had been aborted, think of the benefits. who knows what kind of evil is prevented because of abortion.

one should not be forced by government or religion to reproduce if they do not want to.

everyday we kill creatures big and small because we find them scary, ugly, tasty, or we do it just for the hell of it. can we call the elimination of mosquito larva in a pond a form of genocide? can we call the killing of cows for our dinner a form of genocide? no, we don't call it that because we feel we're justified and doing the right thing. the same goes for abortion. until we cease the killing of the creatures "below" us, i will personally support abortion and what it stands for.

abortion is a good form of population control, as China is currently showing us. it has a use and it beats the alternative of killing adult people who have established human connections and relations.

race wise, whites hold the abortion record thus far (according to some studies). we cannot called abortion racially motivated, nor can we call all genocide racially motivated. hitler not only killed jews, but gays and black people (what few there were in germany) as well. other genocides have been contained in people's own races.

abortion, when elective, is chosen usually because one feels they are incapable of caring for the child. and children are road blocks in the life of a good many people. many people who have had children then wish they had not later on down the road. those children end up being abused, abandoned, or killed by the parents. and if allowed to grow up, those children will most often repeat the patterns of the adults or become psychologically unstable.

abortion is there to prevent a host of problems for both the individual and society as a whole.

Nobody redefined personhood to allow abortion. People are trying to redefine it to prevent abortion though .

"Genesis 2:7 God made Adam's body out of the dust of the earth. Later, the "man became a living soul" only after God "breathed into his nostrils the breath of life." This seems to state clearly that Adam's personhood started when he took his first breath. Following this reasoning, a newborn would become human after it starts breathing; a fetus is only potentially human; an abortion would not terminate the life of a human person. The most important word in the Hebrew Scriptures that was used to describe a person was "nephesh;" it appears 755 times in the Old Testament. It is translated as "living soul" in the above passage. One scholar, H.W. Wolff, 1 believes that the word's root means "to breath." He argues that during Old Testament times, "Living creatures are in this way exactly defined in Hebrew as creatures that breathe.""
https://www.religioustolerance.org/abo_biblh.htm



A lot of things are.



Don't tell republicans that, they might start changing their views on abortion.

"Genesis 2:7 God made Adam's body out of the dust of the earth. Later, the "man became a living soul" only after God "breathed into his nostrils the breath of life." This seems to state clearly that Adam's personhood started when he took his first breath. Following this reasoning, a newborn would become human after it starts breathing; a fetus is only potentially human; an abortion would not terminate the life of a human person. The most important word in the Hebrew Scriptures that was used to describe a person was "nephesh;" it appears 755 times in the Old Testament. It is translated as "living soul" in the above passage. One scholar, H.W. Wolff, 1 believes that the word's root means "to breath." He argues that during Old Testament times, "Living creatures are in this way exactly defined in Hebrew as creatures that breathe.""


No, I can't agree that personhood begins at birth. Also, an infant will breath the fluid in the womb to strengthen its lung prior to being born. And calling an infant prior to birth a 'fetus' and then a 'baby' after it is born is mere terminology. Clearly its a human being since its genetically human. Its not a dog or a cat or a fish.

I am in agreement with the OP that the plight of Native Americans demonstrates genocide better then slavery .
The whole idea behind genocide is to have as high a body count as possible by killing large numbers of men women and children at a time . Hitler was trying for total clearing/cleansing of Jews wasn't he?
And the US government tried the same total wiping off the planet of all Natives Americans.To make clear the way for Americans settling as much land as could be possible.
No one involved in the owning of slaves wanted all slaves dead, They wanted them to do the labor that produced the cash flow . There's no records of any slave owners killing their slaves in large numbers. The only intentional killings were done by the African slave owners and they killed all the males when capturing slaves because it avoided the hassles of runaways and the danger of attacks on the owners.
If some government /leaders ordered all pregnancies terminated and forced all women to do so or else it could be comped but otherwise it's can't be .

Your right, nobody redefined personhood to allow abortion. It was a judicial fiat that redefines the U.S. Constitution.

Republicans are not all inherently racist nor are they all pro-life.

You make a good point though. The more undesirables who can be persuaded to voluntarily remove themselves from the gene pool the more room there will be for those who believe in life.

Except for the (possibly) first point, I don't see how a valid comparison could be made.

'genocide' refers to more than one person. I'm not supporting abortion, I'm just questioning the definition.

I understand why you would question the definition. It seems that the definition of genocide has been expanded upon by the U.N.
https://www.abortionno.org/Resources/abortion10.html

This link is just one source that I've found comparing abortion to genocide and it makes reference to a precedent setting U.N. ruling which broadened the scope of genocidal crimes.

Folks,

What I'd like to argue is that you are ending the life of someone who is entirely helpless, yet you caused them by your irresponsible actions. Abortion is simply a cop out, people HATE taking responsibility for their actions. If the child is a unwanted, put them up for adoption. There are more people in the US looking to adopt children then there are children.


Yours,

Ichooselife

Then why are there thousands of unwanted children in the s***ty foster care systems and orphanages?

I think you have it mixed up.

According to the adoption agency we've been going through, that is a true statistic.


Yours,

Ichooselife

Then explain why there are thousands of unwanted children not being adopted.

If it was such a true statistic there would be no unwanted children floating around, but there is. I wouldn't go through any adoption agency trying to tell me there are more wanting parents than children.