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shadowen On March 22, 2024




Bunyip Bend, Australia
#1New Post! Feb 12, 2017 @ 08:58:22
The governing body of world athletics (IAAF) has finally put a (temporary) stop to changes of nationality by athletes, recognising the system has become open to abuse and that rules are being manipulated.

IAAF president Sebastian Coe said a working group would be set up to agree new rules by the end of the year...

...Will believe it when i see it.
shadowen On March 22, 2024




Bunyip Bend, Australia
#2New Post! Aug 13, 2017 @ 16:16:16
Not quite the farewell Bolt and many were hoping for...
Jennifer1984 On July 20, 2022
Returner and proud





Penzance, United Kingdom
#3New Post! Aug 13, 2017 @ 18:48:32
I too will be happy to see the rules on nationality tightened up. I've posted before about "Plastic Brits", as we call them here.

I'm not a narrow minded nationalist but I've never been happy for GBR to take other countries cast-offs. If an athlete isn't good enough to represent USA (yes, I'm talking about Tiffany Porter), then we shouldn't be the option of second choice. In my opinion those who first try to represent their native country and fail, shouldn't be allowed to exploit lines of ancestry they'd otherwise ignored, to find a "Vest Of Convenience."

Mo Farah is different, in that he came to UK from Somalia as a child and grew up here, took up athletics in this country and developed under the British system. He is a fully naturalised Briton and has never attempted to qualify for or represent Somalia. He is not the same as Tiffany Porter.

As for Usain Bolt, I too was sorry that he couldn't bow out with a victory. Likewise it was a shame too for Mo Farah. But in both cases, the athletes didn't make excuses, showed respect for those who had beaten them and accepted defeat with good grace. That too, is the mark of a great champion. They've left us with marvellous memories and we should be grateful for that.

When Jamaica took Gold, Silver and Bronze in the men's 200 metres at London 2012, we were in the stadium, watching and cheering. It's a wonderful thing when you can say "I was there." It's the second best buzz in sport.

Perhaps the disappointment of Bolt and Farah's final races is sport teaching us all a lesson. Time takes its toll on the greatest and nobody goes on for ever. No matter how great any individual may be, the new order will come along sooner or later and they must step aside to make way for the next generation.

I was disappointed at the booing of Justin Gatlin when he won the 100 metres. It was distasteful and very un-British. Shame on those who did it. Gatlin knows that what he did in the past was wrong and has to live with that. The crowd didn't have to cheer him as wildly as they most certainly would have done a Bolt victory, but polite applause would have told its own story. It would have said "We recognise you've won and applaud you for that, but as a person you do not have our respect."

Well done to GBR 4 x 100 metres teams, both lads and lasses. Gold and Silver respectively is a great achievement in a Games that some here have called a disappointment. Disappointing maybe, but as stated above, the old order must make way for the new and post Farah / Ennis / Rutherford, GBR Athletics is now going into a transitional period.

Sport UK said before the Championships that future funding depends on medals. I hope that doesn't turn out to be the case. It's the funding of the last 20 years that has given GBR sport this period of great success. The funding must be made available to the next generation or it will all end here.
shadowen On March 22, 2024




Bunyip Bend, Australia
#4New Post! Aug 16, 2017 @ 15:46:20
Bolt again calling for a mandatory life ban for drug cheats.

A couple of years ago he is quoted as saying:
"The message should be: ‘If you cheat, you’re going to be kicked out of the sport.' You have to drive fear into athletes, to make them think about the consequences of their actions. If they’re getting an easy penalty why would they care?"

The science is mounting...

Scientists previously thought that the reacquisition of muscle mass - with or without steroids - after periods of inactivity was linked to motor learning.

However, a growing list of new studies reveal there is a celluar ‘memory mechanism’ within muscle of brief steroid users, which could have consequences for the two-year exclusion time of doping offenders as brief exposure to anabolic steroids might have long-lasting performance-enhancing effects that could last for decades.

Researchers at the University of Oslo for example investigated the effects of steroids on muscle reacquisition. They found greater muscle mass and more myonuclei – essential components for muscle fibre function - were apparent after returning to exercise.

The results of a number of international studies strongly suggest that the performance benefits of steroids may last for DECADES.

If there is ANY possibility (and several highly credentialed university studies conclude that there definitely is) that performance enhancing drugs can provide any sort of physical benefit AFTER the athlete last took them then this alone should be grounds for enforcing life bans.

The sad reality is that despite the health risks and despite the attempts by regulating bodies to eliminate drugs from sport, the use of illegal substances is widely acknowledged to be rife. So now when a famous athlete fails a doping test, very few regard it as a shocking revelation.

For years anti doping authorities etc have typically handed out 6-24 month bans for drug cheats, and yet the problem is as bad as ever.

Einstein once said that "insanity is doing the same thing over and over again whilst expecting a different result". Well it's time to stop the insane approach to drug cheats that insists on giving them a second (and even third) chance. It's time to try something significantly different. It's time to look after the clean athletes and ban the cheats for life.
Inteper_Regional On January 14, 2018

Banned



Dayton, Ohio
#5New Post! Aug 16, 2017 @ 22:46:14
I like sports enough to know organizations try to dictate to some degree about sports players they may or not be familiar with. I know this sounds bad, but they are celebrities!!!!!
Jennifer1984 On July 20, 2022
Returner and proud





Penzance, United Kingdom
#6New Post! Aug 22, 2017 @ 11:42:22
@shadowen Said

Bolt again calling for a mandatory life ban for drug cheats.

A couple of years ago he is quoted as saying:
"The message should be: ‘If you cheat, you’re going to be kicked out of the sport.' You have to drive fear into athletes, to make them think about the consequences of their actions. If they’re getting an easy penalty why would they care?"

The science is mounting...

Scientists previously thought that the reacquisition of muscle mass - with or without steroids - after periods of inactivity was linked to motor learning.

However, a growing list of new studies reveal there is a celluar ‘memory mechanism’ within muscle of brief steroid users, which could have consequences for the two-year exclusion time of doping offenders as brief exposure to anabolic steroids might have long-lasting performance-enhancing effects that could last for decades.

Researchers at the University of Oslo for example investigated the effects of steroids on muscle reacquisition. They found greater muscle mass and more myonuclei – essential components for muscle fibre function - were apparent after returning to exercise.

The results of a number of international studies strongly suggest that the performance benefits of steroids may last for DECADES.

If there is ANY possibility (and several highly credentialed university studies conclude that there definitely is) that performance enhancing drugs can provide any sort of physical benefit AFTER the athlete last took them then this alone should be grounds for enforcing life bans.

The sad reality is that despite the health risks and despite the attempts by regulating bodies to eliminate drugs from sport, the use of illegal substances is widely acknowledged to be rife. So now when a famous athlete fails a doping test, very few regard it as a shocking revelation.

For years anti doping authorities etc have typically handed out 6-24 month bans for drug cheats, and yet the problem is as bad as ever.

Einstein once said that "insanity is doing the same thing over and over again whilst expecting a different result". Well it's time to stop the insane approach to drug cheats that insists on giving them a second (and even third) chance. It's time to try something significantly different. It's time to look after the clean athletes and ban the cheats for life.


A typical attitude among those who see simplistic answers to complex problems. And to quote Einstein in relation to sport..?? Laughable.

Doping life bans are not legal. That is, they cannot be enforced in law. To permanently deprive an individual of the means to earn their living when they have not actually committed a criminal offence is not a legal position to take.

OK... let's look at "Legal" and "Criminal" with regard to doping.

The use of performance enhancing agents is an offence against sporting regulations, but may not necessarily be a criminal offence, ie: an offence against the law of the land. Many doping agents do not fall into the category of "Controlled Substances" and therefore are not necessarily illegal. To be in possession of and to self administer does not always constitute criminality. To establish this would take a legal judgement in each country in which it takes place.

For instance, it might be a crime to use (let's call it) Agent X in Britain where it might be a controlled substance, but not in, say, China where it might be legal. Therefore any athlete who trains in China would not be breaking the law if he used it while training there. He has therefore committed no criminal offence at the point of use.

However. Agent X may be considered a performance enhancing agent by WADA and therefore a positive test result would constitute an offence for which a ban is appropriate.

We then get into the realms of what constitutes a lawful ban. Is is legally justifiable to impose an immediate lifetime ban on first offence? Well, the World Anti Doping Agency (WADA) says......... it isn't..!!

WADA Says Lifetime Bans For Doping Are Not Legal

Justice systems in most civilised countries have justice systems which recognise the fallibility of human beings. A sort of "Anybody Can Make A Mistake" thing. They allow for somebody to be given a second chance.

This is just, humane, civilised and satisfies the legal requirements of most just, humane and civilised societies.

To go for an immediate lifetime ban on first offence could be challenged in court and if brought before, say, a British, French, German, Italian, American, Canadian, New Zealand..... (I could go on) court stand a very high likelihood of being successful.

I have no idea what chance of success such an appeal might have in Australia.

It's easy to propose simplistic resolutions to complex problems as an instant cure-all for wrongdoing. But like most simplistic resolutions, it would fall apart when tested in court.

Doping in order to cheat in sport is wrong and it is entirely appropriate to punish those who offend.

But justice must be tempered with mercy and punishments must be appropriate and proportionate, not visceral, poorly thought out and excessive. Repeated offences should be treated accordingly.

Catch them, punish them and then give them another chance. I know some may not agree with that, but it's how it is, and should be.

It is in my country. I don't know about yours.
RobertGap On October 16, 2017
Troll



Kwekwe, Tajikistan
#7New Post! Aug 22, 2017 @ 11:47:16
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shadowen On March 22, 2024




Bunyip Bend, Australia
#8New Post! Aug 22, 2017 @ 15:44:21
@Jennifer1984 Said

Catch them, punish them and then give them another chance. I know some may not agree with that, but it's how it is, and should be.



Really. That's your idea of just and fair is it? That people who choose to cheat and gain an unfair (and illegal) advantage over others are allowed to carry on after a short ban even when there is a growing body of evidence that shows that taking many forms of performance enhancing drugs would most likely give an athlete who cheats a life long advantage over those who dont.

Published research in a number of countries shows that athletes who use steroids for a short period could benefit for their entire careers. A number of performance enhancing drugs boost the number of cell nuclei in the muscle fibres. The extra cell nuclei (vital for increasing strength/power) don't magically disappear once an athlete stops taking PED's. Once they are formed they are there for the long term.

I find it interesting how those athletes who dedicate their life to their chosen sport want life bans, as do the scientists behind the latest research into the long term benefits of even short term PED use. Bolt and other athletes have made their position clear, as have the scientists...

"If the effect of steroids are permanent, shouldn't the exclusion be permanent as well?”

"In science if you cheat, you are out for life, and my personal view is that it should be similar for athletes. It is a harsh treatment but if you really are cheating, I think that's reasonable" - Prof Gundersen.
shadowen On March 22, 2024




Bunyip Bend, Australia
#9New Post! Aug 22, 2017 @ 15:57:58
@Jennifer1984 Said

A typical attitude among those who see simplistic answers to complex problems. And to quote Einstein in relation to sport..?? Laughable.



The problem with athletes taking performance enhancing drugs are many. The way to try and discourage athletes from cheating (and putting their own health at risk) lies largely in better education and stronger sanctions. When athletes who are thinking of taking PED's are weighing up the risks and rewards of doing so they must be faced with the reality that if they are caught their professional career in their chosen sport will be over.

And your approach of giving drug cheats the chance to compete after a short ban is not only unfair to clean athletes (esp in the light of the latest scientific research) but it clearly isnt working. There is still a major drug problem in professional sport esp power sports like weightlifting and sprinting.

Oh, and why do you think sport is somehow intrinsically different from other human endeavours. Einstein's words are as true about sport as any other human activity. In sport (as in other endeavours) if you do what you've always done you'll get what you've always got.
shadowen On March 22, 2024




Bunyip Bend, Australia
#10New Post! Aug 22, 2017 @ 16:02:07
@Jennifer1984 Said

Doping life bans are not legal. That is, they cannot be enforced in law. To permanently deprive an individual of the means to earn their living when they have not actually committed a criminal offence is not a legal position to take.


Bollocks. There are a number of jobs where you can face a life ban from the profession without having committed a criminal offence.

By the way, the latest research into the long term benefits of even short term use of PED's will mean that at some point in the future life bans for taking specific drugs will come into play.
shadowen On March 22, 2024




Bunyip Bend, Australia
#11New Post! Aug 22, 2017 @ 16:23:23
@Jennifer1984 Said

Catch them, punish them and then give them another chance.


Personally I am more concerned with doing the right thing by athletes who don't cheat rather than being overly concerned with what's in the best interests for those who do cheat.
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Telferovalt On August 25, 2017




Halmstad, Russia
#14New Post! Aug 25, 2017 @ 23:40:01
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CurtisDeeva On November 02, 2017

Banned



Quatre Bornes, Mauritius
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