Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

@4d4m Said

The shroud of Turin has been carbon dated to between 1260 and 1390 AD. Some people believe the image is that of Jacques du Molay who died in 1314. The only problem with that theory is that he was burned at the stake.

@Erimitus Said


Chaski: Jesus the person apparently existed. Flavius Josephus wrote about him, so there must have been a person who was Jesus.

Erimitus: In ‘the Jewish Wars’ JC was mentioned in a single paragraph. That paragraph is fiction… Everyone, even the most ardent Bible thumpers, agree that that paragraph and at least to some degree interpolation.

@4d4m Said

There are a lot more than 4 gospels archeologists and historians know about. There were 4 included in the New Testament by the Romans who hijacked the religion when it became apparent there were too many Christians to feed to lions without the possibility of an uprising. Here is a comprehensive list of known gospels.

@chaski Said

Ok.

I will go back and review my sources of information.

On the other hand... as an example... the fact that there was no place actually named "Troy" does not mean that the "Trojan War" did not happen.


Surely the references to the gods were fictional... surely Achilles and his life were exaggerated... but that does not mean that an Achilles like warrior did not exist. The ancients surly had another name for it.

In addition, there is some historically based information that Agamemnon existed...

Do we call "him" fictional because there was no definitive documentary evidence? Because there is no text that spells out his name exactly as we spell it out?

Honestly, I do not think that the existence of a man named Jesus is in question... much less in questions than Saul/Paul at any rate....

>>> JOSEPH CAMPBELL: We just don’t, know about Jesus. All we know are four contradictory texts that tell us what he did. <<<

The context of the sentence does in no way refute the existent of a man named Jesus... it only questions who or what Jesus actually was... what he did in his life.

@chaski Said

Yes, I was listening and neither you nor 4d4m nor anyone else answered my question until now...

You have now answered my question with your statement that "Jesus....asked him to... do it."

Of course that would mean the Judas didn't actually betray Jesus, but rather he was following orders... which largely fits with the idea that he was predestined to do it, as opposed to being a treacherous scumbag.

@4d4m Said

If you read the gospels with a different eye, you will find them to be extremely dark.

@4d4m Said

I doubt Jesus asked him to do it. It might be a way of making an excuse for Judas. If you read the gospels with a different eye, you will find them to be extremely dark.