"Post-digestive- nuggets"  Erimitus
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The mind of God, Antarctica
Joined: Jun 2009 |
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There is a part of me that society would deem unacceptable; a part of me that I have been taught to be ashamed of. I have to hide much of myself in response to the expectations of others. I have to hide much of myself even from my self. And this is all for the sake of appearing to be what others require me to be; to appear moral, to appear normal. I pretend that I am really good (whatever that means). A fraudulent goodness. | |
Electric_Banana
| Was it the fraudulent/dishonest handling from others that forced into you into a corner and turned you to fraud in the first place?
If so - You are forgiven; by myself at least.
I had corrupt friends when I was younger. I knew the situation was not their fault and the result of an arrogant and ignorant society bureaucratically attempting to toss them in the rubbish.
The Law is the Law
but sometimes Crime is not always Crime; in those instances it is forced survival.
Honest men turned to snakes by professional snakes. |
JR_Sanford
| @Erimitus Said 
There is a part of me that society would deem unacceptable; a part of me that I have been taught to be ashamed of. I have to hide much of myself in response to the expectations of others. I have to hide much of myself even from my self. And this is all for the sake of appearing to be what others require me to be; to appear moral, to appear normal. I pretend that I am really good (whatever that means). A fraudulent goodness.
This sounds as though you want to "come out" and admit to the ones who don't really know you that you are attracted to your own gender. It's important that YOU are happy with yourself NO MATTER WHAT. It's YOUR LIFE! Live it any way you want.
J.R. |
twilitezone911
| i am not fraud in the right word for you this for the topic. being a fraud, one decieve someone else, not decieve yourself. ' fear ' or lack of confidence is a better explanation for this topic. we all have doubts ourselves. fraud is someone try to sell oneself to be more than they are. i feel sorry a little bit for these frauds. because they are hurting themselves more than their victims. i don't think people that hide from people wear a mask, not hurting them, but hurting themselves. you must take risks to meet people, and express yourself. this forum is a way to still wear a mask. for example, my real name is not ' twilitezone911 ', my real name is ' mr. '.  if you need to wear a mask, and still in express yourself, you are not a fraud. you are afraid or lack of confidence in yourself. but if you are trying to get out of your shell. you are just human being, that is very normal.  |
Erimitus
| EB: Was it the fraudulent/dishonest handling from others that forced you into a corner and turned you to fraud in the first place?
E: I had not thought of that but I believe that you are correct. I would bet that everyone is pretending to some degree. We have to pretend if we want to be considered sane. Almost everyone is incessantly judging and being judged, playing a role, wearing their costume, and pretending to be what they are not.
If so - You are forgiven; by myself at least.
E: Well, thank you. I feel much better now. |
Erimitus
| EB: I had corrupt friends when I was younger. I knew the situation was not their fault but the result of an arrogant and ignorant society bureaucratically attempting to toss them in the rubbish.
E: Yes, they to were taught to adhere to the arbitrary moralities of society and attempt to appear moral and normal even when it is such appearance is against their nature.
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EB: The Law is the Law
but sometimes Crime is not always Crime; in those instances it is forced survival.
E: I would say that not all crime is immoral and not all immorality is a crime. It might be a crime to jaywalk, but if there is no traffic around, I don't see how it could be considered. immoral. And we might consider adultery immoral, but in many places it is not a crime. Driving on the correct wrong side of the street is not only a crime it also decreases the potential
for survival.
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EB: Honest men turned to snakes by professional snakes...
E: I suspect the professional snakes were at one time honest. I cannot not see how morality is could be innate. If morality is inherent, then every person and every society would have the same moral code. And even a cursory inspection demonstrates that they do not. |
Electric_Banana
| @Erimitus Said
E: I suspect the professional snakes were at one time honest. I cannot not see how morality is could be innate. If morality is inherent, then every person and every society would have the same moral code. And even a cursory inspection demonstrates that they do not.
I use this guidline:
When someone tells me they hurt - I worry for them.
I suspect most do too.
If someone tells me they hurt because I've injured them in some way - I worry even more and feel even worse for them because I did not want anyone to hurt and to hurt because of my actions makes me even sadder.
In such instances I would try and amend the situation in anyway I could.
This is the basic principles of morality and most agree on it.
Those bureaucratically forced into crime snatch purses with no consideration that critical health pills may be in that purse or that the small funds in the stolen purse were the last resource that woman had to feed a starving baby at home. At the point of being driven desperate, by a corrupt world template, the survivor has usually also lost the better wit to plan & foresee the detriment he or she may cause.
They are innocent on account of insanity - insanity resulting from desperation.
In the afterlife the robbed woman also realizes that her efforts (or lack thereof) supported such a society that could make an honest man lie and she too forgives. |
Erimitus
| E: I have paraphrased a little to make sure I understand your meaning not to change it.
TZ: I am not [sure] fraud [is] the right word for you this for the topic. A fraud one deceives someone else, not [one's self]. ' Fear ' or lack of confidence is a better explanation for this topic.
E: Fear and lack of self confidence are elements. Denial and self deception seem to help us get through to day.
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TZ: We all have doubts ourselves.
E: Most people seem to have self doubt. Many try to hide it.
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TZ: Fraud is trying to sell oneself to be more than they are.
E: yes.
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TZ: I feel sorry a little bit for these frauds; because they are hurting themselves more than their victims.
E: Yes. Sometimes we lie to ourselves so often that we begin to believe the lie.
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TZ: I don't think people that hide from people wear a mask...
E: I have been thinking that we all wear masks (costumes) as we play our roles.
TZ: [Wearing a mask does not harm others]
E: the mask does not always harm others but it if the intention is to deceive a result could be harm.
TZ: [wearing a mask hurts the person wearing it]
E: If the person wearing the mask forgets that it is only a mask and starts to believe the role being played is reality it could result in unintentional self harm and maybe even intentional self harm if the reality becomes apparent. (e.g. Death of a Salesman)
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TZ: You must take risks to meet people, and express yourself.
E: Yes, whether you are attempting to deceive or attempting to be honest.
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TZ: This forum is a way to still wear a mask.
E: Yes
TZ: my real name is not ' twilitezone911 '
E: What! I never suspected. Erimitus is my real name, or one of my real names. I had a name assigned to me at birth. I suppose that is my real (legal) name. Many people have more than one name; contractions (e.g. Michael and Mike), nicknames (e.g. lefty). I suppose someone named Nicholas or Nick already has a nic-name.
E: The danger of taking off ones mask on a forum is probably minimal. One could be banned or ostracized.
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TZ: If you need to wear a mask, and still express yourself, you are not a fraud.
E: I believe that I understand what you are saying and if I do understand correctly I agree but that would be a very difficult and dangerous thing to do.
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TZ: If you need to wear a mask, and still express yourself, you are not a fraud you are afraid or lack of confidence in yourself.
E: I would say both a fraud and afraid. As we have discussed before it is not always wise to be honest. Maybe some people can wear their mask and at be honest at the same time without stepping out of character.
TZ: if you are trying to get out of your shell. You are just human being, that is very normal.
E: Yes, some, maybe most do not even realize that they are in a shell.
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E: Thank you. Many excellent points. |
Erimitus
| JR: This sounds as though you want to "come out" and admit to the ones who don't really know you that you are attracted to your own gender.
E: I believe that most moral codes attempt to dictate appropriate sexual behaviors. And, as a result, sexual proclivities inconsistent with contemporary regional standards are often suppressed. In a society where homosexuality is punishable by death it would be prudent to suppress the urge. It might be best to control any desire for farm animals or small children, and, although acceptable in some cultures, in western societies it is a good idea to have only one wife.
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JR: It's important that YOU are happy with yourself NO MATTER WHAT.
E: I think that happiness may be the teleology of most people's actions. Some argue that the end of all actions is directed at pleasure (or at least the absence of pain). And, of course, some feel that pleasure and happiness are the same thing. I agree with you that happiness is important. I am not sure I can agree with your; 'no matter what'; maybe 'no matter what' as long as it does not result in unnecessary harm to one's self or to others.
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JR: It's YOUR LIFE! Live it any way you want.
E: I think that would depend on what makes you happy...
E: Anyway, it may be a good idea to conform to the regional moral codes. |
DuLu
CHOOSE HAPPINESS!!!
| Q1: How much time does each of us (or any one person) spend, typically speaking, thinking about/reflecting on those things that we are thinking about?
Q2: Why does one do this?
Q3: What does it accomplish, if anything -- except more thoughts about thoughts
.... about thoughts .... about thoughts. Hats off to those who can turn on
or off the live-streaming of those thoughts at will. Like changing the channel or
turning the TV or radio off/on. It all should be that simple.
Q4: Where does ones thoughts come from? And where are they going to, their final destination? How much control do we have over all of that? |
Erimitus
| DuLu Q1: How much time does each of us (or any one person) spend, typically speaking, thinking about/reflecting on those things that we are thinking about?
Erimitus: I suspect that with, the exception of philosophers, no one spends any time thinking about these things.
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DuLu: Q2: Why does one do this?
Erimitus: I do not know. It seems to just happen. Maybe they took the red pill.
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DuLu: Q3a.: What does it accomplish, if anything -- except more thoughts about thoughts.... about thoughts .... about thoughts.
Erimitus: The questions are both unavoidable and unanswerable. And, as you point out, each tentative answer generates more questions, so the more we know the less we understand. It is almost like knowing and understanding are inversely proportional.
Erimitus: Maybe it helps us to develop a personal morality as opposed to the morality imposed by society and inculcated from birth.
Erimitus: Maybe it helps us to determine what to do and who we are but probably more what to do than who we are.
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DuLu Q3b.: Hats off to those who can turn on or off the live-streaming of those thoughts at will. Like changing the channel or turning the TV or radio off/on. It all should be that simple.
Erimitus: It seems to me that these thoughts can be suppressed and denied but they are always at the threshold of consciousness ready to impinge on the reality that I have created for myself. That is how it works for me anyway. I doubt I am normal by any standard. In fact normal people really scare me.
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DuLu: Q4a.: Where does ones thoughts come from?
Erimitus: They seem to just happen.
DuLu: Q4b.:And where are [one's thoughts] going to, their final destination?
Erimitus: I am not sure I understand your question. If you are asking what is the purpose of one's thoughts my guess is that they a some kind of survival mechanism.
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DuLu: How much control do we have over all of that?
Erimitus: I have no way of knowing, of course, but I suspect that most people have very little control. There are, I have been told, cognitive behavior techniques that can work.
Erimitus: It may be that there are people who can transform or at least control their thoughts by being conscious of their consciousness.
Erimitus: Personally I have no delusions of adequacy. I strive for mediocrity. Mediocrity, for me, would be a step up.
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DuLu
CHOOSE HAPPINESS!!!
| Erimitus: Love your statement: "In fact, normaly people really scare me."
You, nor anyone else, has anything to fear from normal people.
Those that one believes are normal, or appear/ACT AS IF they're normal at least --
are faudulent. They take their pants down to use the loo same as any one else
does. Their s**t stinks/doesn't stink in the same fashion as other people's s**t.
They (the elusive 'they' - the ones you started off comparing yourself to - directly/indirectly) are the fraudulent ones --- but they also are being held
hostage by society to present themselves in those ways. |
Electric_Banana
| @DuLu Said
Q1: How much time does each of us (or any one person) spend, typically speaking, thinking about/reflecting on those things that we are thinking about?
Q2: Why does one do this?
Q3: What does it accomplish, if anything -- except more thoughts about thoughts
.... about thoughts .... about thoughts. Hats off to those who can turn on
or off the live-streaming of those thoughts at will. Like changing the channel or
turning the TV or radio off/on. It all should be that simple.
Q4: Where does ones thoughts come from? And where are they going to, their final destination? How much control do we have over all of that?
Speculation happens when we begin questioning why we are here in the first place.
People question things when they've grown tired and no longer want to endure them. ie; A wife starts questioning her marriage to her husband.
Some concern that we may have to commit suicide mutliple times over before we can truly R.I.P. leads us to asking whether or not we truly die once we perish from 'Planet Earth.' |
Electric_Banana
| @Erimitus Said
DuLu Q3b.: Hats off to those who can turn on or off the live-streaming of those thoughts at will. Like changing the channel or turning the TV or radio off/on. It all should be that simple.
Erimitus: It seems to me that these thoughts can be suppressed and denied but they are always at the threshold of consciousness ready to impinge on the reality that I have created for myself. That is how it works for me anyway. I doubt I am normal by any standard. In fact normal people really scare me.
Anger and disappoinment most often starts the train back down that track again.
Those who experience proper and healthy lives with moderatble contrast (to challenge and mold them) find more constructive means to overcome temporary bouts of frustration.
Some of us, however, are champions and so we get handed the Sysphus challenge.
Personally I only challenged that I could figure out how life works before I die and live my entire life without beauty, acclaim or glory; I never said I could do all that as well live happily below a Lower Middle Class lifestyle. Guess that last bit was tacked on for 'Extra Credit.'
I wanted to be a humble genius...not Gargamel. |
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Fraud:
October 19, 2014 @ 10:47:57 pm
