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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 11:11:50#1
the7thdimension

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911 had an unforseen impact on all of us. Husbands, wives, children, and all the like were shocked by the events that unfolded that day. The collapse of the world trade center is admittedly the most studied in engineering history. Engineers and scientists from all walks of life have adopted their own views and ripened to a divide on the issue. Some see a lack of evidence and gaping holes in the official explanation and others stick by the official "evidence". Unfortunately, a large portion of this evidence has been withheld from the public, ruling it impossible for the opposing sides to disprove one another. The ensuing stokes the flames of a conversation that will most likely end in "I know more about this than you do". As you can see, it has become a perplex and delicate situation.

A portion of the truth movement are in fact family members of the deceased. You can't just call these people "leftists", they deserve an explanation. You could say the hardship of losing a loved one inspires one to "try to find things that aren't there", but that doesn't account for the remaining; actively growing group that tirelessly questions the 911 commission's story. These individuals pose a few deserving questions. Why were traces of thermite found at the base of ground zero? How could the towers have fallen at freefall speed? How exactly did building 7 fall at freefall speed after only a small portion of the building was ignited? Where are the tapes for the Pentagon crash? Why was NORAD on a training excercise that day and told to "stand down"? These are the kind of inaccuracies that make or break a case, and they're all issues that the 911 commission has failed to properly approach.

Until the government recognizes that these people won't just accept any story (especially one that justified a war), 911 truthers are going nowhere. Skeptics need to stop citing irrelevant examples and really immerse themselves in the questions of their counterpart. How can we spend months at a time discussing Britney Spears on headline news yet fail to address the questions of our concerned citizens? The government fails to explore the claims. The media loosely grazes it. It's becoming a lot like a game of cat and mouse. Except, the cat and the mouse can switch places in a heartbeat.

Why not just spend a full week on the news with a play by play of the events on September 11? Afraid maybe? Wouldn't all the skeptics just love it to get their apathetic community back? Honestly, both the skeptics and the truthers would like this to end...NOW. Saying "it never will end" will just propel us towards these problems in the future. We need to come together as a nation (once more to fully explore any and every possibility. Withheld evidence must be made public as its entirely necessary (plus way after the fact), and each side's points must be unwaveringly discussed. A commission of truthers aside skeptics could be formed to make sure nothing is left unanswered. Most importantly, this process is only capable of success at the uncensored discretion of the American public.

There you go media, you got what you want (a full week of headline coverage). There you go people (skeptics and truthers may once again live in harmony). There you go government... (oh s**t)!


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the7thdimension last visited July 24, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 11:17:33#2
crazychica

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What people need for others to stop bringing it up time and time again. It happened and there have been plenty of engineers and people with a basic knowledge of civil engineering trying to explain this to you before. Even the thermite makes sense when you bring in the fact that thermite is powdered aluminium and iron, which were made available when the crash happened. The engineers you've pulled up "testimony" from are not civil engineers. Engineering is a wide field. Stop giving us these "experts" who know as much about building collapse as my month-old baby niece. Please just let it rest.


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crazychica last visited June 19, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 11:24:32#3
the7thdimension

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I didn't give you any experts, but there are in fact civil engineers who disagree with the explanation. your a bright girl, research it and come back when you don't have your mind made up already.


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the7thdimension last visited July 24, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 11:29:37#4
crazychica

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the7thdimension said:
I didn't give you any experts, but there are in fact civil engineers who disagree with the explanation. your a bright girl, research it and come back when you don't have your mind made up already.


I've already researched it and I agree with the majority opinion because it makes much more sense to me when I put it together with what I already know about civil engineering. You've even had a civil engineer on TFS tell you that that's the most likely explanation. It doesn't matter that he just graduate (from the best uni ever), he knows what he's talking about. Even with my limited knowledge, falling buildings fall downwards when the vertical forces are out of balance. They fall sideways when the horizontal forces are out of balance. When the buildings fell, it was because the upwards force was weaker then the forces pulling them down and so they went they only way they could go - down.


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crazychica last visited June 19, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 11:38:52#5
the7thdimension

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can we both admit that the most likely explanation is NOT ALWAYS THE ACTUAL EXPLANATION




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the7thdimension last visited July 24, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 11:40:15#6
the7thdimension

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can you explain to me why nato was told to stand down

can you explain why bush sat with his thumb up his a** for an hour after being told.

can u explain to me why our government didn't tell people to leave the buildings, they actually told them to go back to work.


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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 18:14:49#7
crazychica

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1) I don't know anything about that but the laws of physics are generally right and don't really change for anything.

2) He was with school kids at the time. What d'you want him to do, run out immediately even though there's nothing he can do and scare a bunch of little kids or do what the president in Scary Movie 3 did and terrify them?

3) It wasn't the government. It was recordings and people inside the buildings who hadn't a clue what was going on. This has been verified by survivors. I would trust them more than a conspiracy webpage/book. They are primary witnesses after all.


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crazychica last visited June 19, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 18:16:25#8
jmo

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This gives weight to the whole thing about questioning everything, and prejudice.

We are all prejudiced, and this is what happens when there is a complete lack of prejudice.


jmo last visited July 24, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 18:26:36#9
crazychica

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jmo said:
This gives weight to the whole thing about questioning everything, and prejudice.

We are all prejudiced, and this is what happens when there is a complete lack of prejudice.


Except there's not a lack of prejudice here. This has came from conspiracies. The other theory makes more sense logically and adhere's to the laws of physics and engineering. Prove to me that it was a demolition and I'll believe it but for now I'll stick to what I know and what is provable. Sure, the most likely situation isn't always the true sequence of events but in this case, it's all just conjecture ranging from the eccentric to the wildly impossible. And conjecture without evidence is nothing.

As for the other theory. Planes are made of aluminium, the building contained steel and rust. Thermite is a mix of powdered aluminium and rust (it's not even a compound, just a mix). Plane smashes into building leading to lots of powdered aluminium and rust being produced.

Next, any substance weakens as it heats up. The buildings are under extra stress due to crash destroying other supports on building. Supports buckle and buildings moves only way it can - down.

A building subjected to conditions it wasn't meant to stand will collapse as will any other structure.


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crazychica last visited June 19, 2008
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New Post! Mar 20, 2008 @ 18:31:13#10
jmo

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I mean i'm all for questioning things, and not taking things for granted, and I do believe, with alot of things, that we should look into things for ourselves. But there is a limit.

The 9/11 attacks were a terrorist attack. There is no point in questioning things like this, it just becomes rediculous after a while. I mean if your questioning the legitimy of the 9/11 attacks then where do you stop? I mean do you need to prove for yourself that the world is round? Or do you need to prove to yourself that you still have 10 fingers everytime you wake up?

It just becomes rediculous mr Dimension, you need to stop questioning everything, other wise, what is the point?


jmo last visited July 24, 2008
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New Post! Mar 24, 2008 @ 07:46:46#11
the7thdimension

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because my friend, thats what makes the answer so sweet


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New Post! Apr 02, 2008 @ 07:20:17#12
bikerdave

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crazychica said:
What people need for others to stop bringing it up time and time again. It happened and there have been plenty of engineers and people with a basic knowledge of civil engineering trying to explain this to you before. Even the thermite makes sense when you bring in the fact that thermite is powdered aluminium and iron, which were made available when the crash happened. The engineers you've pulled up "testimony" from are not civil engineers. Engineering is a wide field. Stop giving us these "experts" who know as much about building collapse as my month-old baby niece. Please just let it rest.


Its attitudes like this which let people away with stuff.

"Its too hard, just let it fade into obscurity"

The engineering, and physical side of this is overshadowing the intent. I believe the truth will come from whistleblowers in years to come. Im not gonna put my eggs in any baskets and try to predict what happened in detail that day, i dont know (as no-one does) How deeply involved teh Govornemnt was. Im guessing as little as possible whilst still allowing the attacks to happen.

All im gonna say is im glad the Bush administration isnt my Govornment. Wouldnt want my govornment to let me die as a pretext for war.

Which IMO is simply a definite.

And JMO, read your post back to yoruself, now imagine leaked memo's prove the administration knew about teh attacks and failed to stop them, or even actively sought to confuse US authorities. I just ask that you imagine.

Not everyone thinks teh US commited teh attacks, but many assume the US turned a blind eye, or actively helped by weakening defenses.

Which, intentionally or not, happened that day as a matter of recorded fact.

And remember people. This debate has happened before. And currently released documents show that die hard patriots and thoretical sceptics were indeed wrong about Pearl Harbour.

So, i aint saying any of us nkow what happened, but if you dont keep an open mind, and dont keep questioning things like this, your only leaving yourself open for a kick in the balls.

NEVER, trust a ruling govornemnts word, or especially internal commissions and inquiries. Remember, the govornemnt scrutinises itself, then feeds you the information.

The truth is, not one person on this forum knows. And wont for some time.
bikerdave last visited April 08, 2008
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New Post! Apr 02, 2008 @ 18:15:22#13
crazychica

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Maybe we can't know for sure but we do know that there were no holograms, no demolition, no explosives and I have explained the traces of thermite and if it had been thermite used, everyone would have seen it. The US is not the only country to be hit by terror. That's twice I've sat in front of the tv in tears because members of my family have been in the area where a terror-attack has happened.

You may think I'm close-minded but I'm a forensic science student and I've studied history and politics too. So why not just accept that there are people out there who want you dead or converted and will stop at nothing to do it. In the meantime, learn to spell and analyse evidence please.


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crazychica last visited June 19, 2008
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New Post! Apr 03, 2008 @ 01:39:09#14
diomedes

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I still don't understand why people can't believe that a bunch of pissed off terrorists hijacked a plane and killed themselves and others by flying the planes into two towers in hopes of getting 72 virgins. Guess what, you get your virgins Osama and you know what, they're all guys just like you.


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diomedes last visited June 26, 2008
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New Post! Apr 03, 2008 @ 09:57:01#15
crazychica

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diomedes said:
I still don't understand why people can't believe that a bunch of pissed off terrorists hijacked a plane and killed themselves and others by flying the planes into two towers in hopes of getting 72 virgins. Guess what, you get your virgins Osama and you know what, they're all guys just like you.




But yeah, hard to believe that people laugh in the face of evidence calling it false or saying that it "clouds the issue".


Catch me as I fall,
And even more so while I'm standing tall.
crazychica last visited June 19, 2008
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