"Post-digestive- nuggets"  Erimitus
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The mind of God, Antarctica
Joined: Jun 2009 |
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Groups, sub-groups and individuals have systems of values and principles of conduct (either tacit or explicit) that determines the extent to which a thought or action is right or wrong. Such systems can be called moral standards. Standards tend to be contemporary regional constructs. I am not sure that there are any absolute moralities. (i.e., there is nothing that is either good or bad that thinking does not make it so) I understand that to mean that there is no innate, intrinsic morality.
note: I use the term morality here as a synonym for ethics. If you were to argue that morality refers to good and evil; ethics refers to good and bad; and etiquette refers to right and wrong. All arguable of course; but everything is arguable. That is how I use the terms. Here ...here (in order to simplify) I suggest we use the terms morality and ethics as synonyms.
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Erimitus
| Morality has something to do with free will.
Free Will enables a agent to act deliberately.
An agent who acts deliberately is responsible for its actions.
An agent's deliberate actions may be voluntary or involuntary |
twilitezone911
| @Erimitus Said 
Groups, sub-groups and individuals have systems of values and principles of conduct (either tacit or explicit) that determines the extent to which a thought or action is right or wrong. Such systems can be called moral standards. Standards tend to be contemporary regional constructs. I am not sure that there are any absolute moralities. (i.e., there is nothing that is either good or bad that thinking does not make it so) I understand that to mean that there is no innate, intrinsic morality.
note: I use the term morality here as a synonym for ethics. If you were to argue that morality refers to good and evil; ethics refers to good and bad; and etiquette refers to right and wrong. All arguable of course; but everything is arguable. That is how I use the terms. Here ...here (in order to simplify) I suggest we use the terms morality and ethics as synonyms.
principles are morality and ethics are the same, they are standards of what person's ego are design for in the person's dna.
morality is your belief of what you feel that right and wrong. ethics is what are you willing to hold by your principles and disciples.
free will is state of mind that is at the point that which you question or maybe your morality and ethics. you question yourself with a problem or you reach a point in your life or satisfied in your life you reach.
second part:
a groups that behavior is questionable or ethic sound like a group that is a mob.
a group is organization to discuss with non-violent agenda is healthy. but a mob is questionable their molarity and ethics. the mob confuse or angry to see what is right or wrong. ethics is the whys behind that the group is a mob, whether the mob understand morality of justified of their actions in the present and their futures is questionable. |
Erimitus
| TZ: (paraphrased) [The] principles [of] morality and ethics are the same...
E: There is a foundational proposition used to distinguish between right and wrong
E: What is this fundamental principle? |
Erimitus
| TZ: (paraphrased) [The] principles [of] morality and ethics are standards of what person's ego are design for in the person's dna.
E: I do not understand. |
Erimitus
| TZ: morality is your belief of what you feel that right and wrong.
E: sounds like a good definition to me.
TZ: ethics is what are you willing to hold by your principles and disciples.
E: If I understand correctly morality is what you believe is good and ethics is what you actually do.
E: Good behavior is adherence to personal and social standards of conduct. We can know what is good behavior yet not behave in a way that is consistent with that which is considered good.
E: That which an individual believes is good behavior and that which the society the individual lives in considers good behavior may not be the same.
S: to thy own self be true. |
Erimitus
| TZ: free will is (state of mind) that is at the point that which you question or maybe your morality and ethics. you question yourself with a problem or you reach a point in your life or satisfied in your life you reach.
E: Free will is the ability to choose between alternatives.
E: if there is no choice there is no moral responsibility. |
Erimitus
| 
TZ: a groups that behavior is questionable or ethic sound like a group that is a mob.
E: A mob is a disorderly group intent on causing trouble or violence. The key word is disorder.
E: A mob tends to behave in a way that the individuals constituting the mob would not behave when alone.
Pat: you can't fight city hall
Mike: no, but you can burn it down.
Here we have oppressors and oppressed discussing inequities. |
Erimitus
| TZ: a group is organization to discuss with non-violent agenda is healthy.
E: an organized group is good
E: a disorganized group may not be good.
Here, for example, is an organized group |
twilitezone911
| @Erimitus Said
TZ: (paraphrased) [The] principles [of] morality and ethics are the same...
E: There is a foundational proposition used to distinguish between right and wrong
E: What is this fundamental principle?
what I think of " the fundamental principle " is your beliefs could be challenge weather it's faith or what society is tell you, who you are and where you fit.
the term of " fundamental principle " mean principles from which other truths can be derived.
many ways, find the truth or have the truth that have explain the whole problem in a way that make sense. or truth give you that comfort your needs.
faith that people believe in, give reassure that give satisfied someone like god is watching over you. at least, you have a fan.
fundamental principle is moral and ethics that you believe in and you will stand for no matter what. |
twilitezone911
| @Erimitus Said
TZ: (paraphrased) [The] principles [of] morality and ethics are standards of what person's ego are design for in the person's dna.
E: I do not understand.
who you are that dna has more the chemicals in your body. your parents's dnas are within you.
the combination of your dna and your parent's dna make you the kind person, you are.
you inherited something from your parents's dna, not only a psychical appearance, but they were. |
Erimitus
| TZ: a mob is questionable their morality and ethics. the mob confuse or angry to see what is right or wrong.
E: A mob could be equated to animal instinct and not reason.
E: this concept Could be expanded.
Voluntary action. Involuntary action. And ...non-voluntary actions. |
Erimitus
| TZ: ethics is the whys behind that the group is a mob, whether the mob understand morality of justified of their actions in the present and their futures is questionable
E: The behavior of a mob is based on emotion, not reason. Is Correct behavior (moral actions) based on reason? Are moral actions conditioned responses.
E: what is the basis of a choice that is made between alternatives. Greed, selfishness, altruism?
E: (assuming free will) an agent can choose between alternatives but ...but the agent cannot choose what the alternatives are. e.g., I am playing cards and I have been dealt a hand. The cards are my alternatives, how I play the cards is determined by free will.
E: But ...but although I am free to choose between the alternatives; the way I play the cards is predetermined by the conditioning of past experience.
E: If there is free will it is constrained.
E: If there is not free will; I am not responsible for my actions; and ...and I am not morally accountable |
twilitezone911
| a mob not only violent, only if it is last resort.
yes, a mob can be only forming to be heard. I am not sure that a mob is always violent, need to be form. if a single individuals can't reach their agenda in the proper way like standards and laws that both sides agree on or not.
one individual can form a mob, and one individual can stop a mob in forming. |
twilitezone911
| @Erimitus Said
TZ: ethics is the whys behind that the group is a mob, whether the mob understand morality of justified of their actions in the present and their futures is questionable
E: The behavior of a mob is based on emotion, not reason. Is Correct behavior (moral actions) based on reason? Are moral actions conditioned responses.
E: what is the basis of a choice that is made between alternatives. Greed, selfishness, altruism?
E: (assuming free will) an agent can choose between alternatives but ...but the agent cannot choose what the alternatives are. e.g., I am playing cards and I have been dealt a hand. The cards are my alternatives, how I play the cards is determined by free will.
E: But ...but although I am free to choose between the alternatives; the way I play the cards is predetermined by the conditioning of past experience.
E: If there is free will it is constrained.
E: If there is not free will; I am not responsible for my actions; and ...and I am not morally accountable
free will is like playing poker.
let us said that you hand is " full house " and you will win.
in situation, a mob that is rational can be divide in " full house ". they have choose believe they are right. but question, ethics if they are right or wrong.
they have decide with 50/50 change to choose the decision.
a mob has choices, but they don't have ever right to take the law in their hands, even they feel they are right. |
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Morality
February 18, 2017 @ 08:11:15 am
