pretty much, that's why I've been saying the term "selling out" is stupid, irrelevant to music and has no reflection on quality of music.

Tweaking the recording process to get the sound the band wants is not selling out, and selling out is not a stupid term. It actually has meaning.

It's not for the purpose of selling more albums, it's for the purpose of creating the sound the band wants.

Using engineers and producers in a studio is not selling out, it's a completely different concept.

"tweaking" sound to improve quality and clarity, in order to make songs more popular and more radio friendly, is very much selling out.
but if you want to argue they're only doing because "its the sound they want" you feel free, i obviously disagree, but there's not a lot we can do about that.

but why do you think selling out isn't a stupid term?

Because your definition of "selling out" is wrong. There are bands who record in a studio but don't use a producer to post-produce the music to make it sound more organic.

selling out has nothing to do with the recording process. if i as a guitarist was some echo in my mix, i can add that to the recording. that is not selling out. improving clarity and quality is not selling out, who would not want a good sound to the mix?

if you are talking about "writing popular(trendy) songs" to appease to the people, then i consider that "selling out"

i never said all bands did.

selling out
"compromising, changing (yourself or something you made) in order to increase your appeal"


once again im pointing out, practically all major bands have sold out in some way, but it doesn't matter because those bands are still great talented bands making good music.
which is way the term selling out, is stupid.

selling out doesn't automatically = bad

Producing an album is not selling out, sorry. You're completely and utterly wrong to the point of making no sense at all.

You dislike the term selling out and you're trying to define it in such a way that it sounds stupid. Well, of course it sounds stupid if you define everything involved in the process of making music selling out. By your definition, the tone knob on an electric guitar is selling out.

Selling out isn't "changing sound in any way."

that's a prime example of what i'm getting at.

clearly they sold out, but so what?
many many people (including myself) enjoyed that album.

but fair enough some people didn't, that's no problem.
but saying you disliked it, not because of the sound, but because they sold out is stupid.

They sold out, so it becomes more difficult to appreciate the music as art, it dilutes the band's influence on other musicians, and it generally becomes less relevant.

When a band sells out, they can no longer be groundbreaking or revolutionary. They abandon the fundamentals that attracted fans in the first place.

Does it mean they suck? No. Lots of artists sell out and their music is good and enjoyable. Some start off by selling out and their music is still good.

producing and changing the sound of an album in order to increase its appeal, isn't selling out?

you believe that if you want.

I DO dislike it because of how it sounds.